Linked by Thom Holwerda on Sat 23rd Dec 2006 00:48 UTC, submitted by dumbkiwi
KDE This is a response to the article yesterday on the progress of GNOME and KDE. Aaron Seigo, a lead KDE developer, sets out the current state of progress with KDE 4, pointing out that KDE 4 is on track for a release in mid 2007. "Thom points to a quote from me that our goal is to have a 4.0 ready sometime in the first half of next year. That gives us until sometime in June and I'm still thinking we can make it."
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RE: A lot of crap on that blog
by superstoned on Sat 23rd Dec 2006 11:53 UTC in reply to "A lot of crap on that blog"
superstoned
Member since:
2005-07-07

Kwin is build to be able to use XRENDER or OpenGL, so hardware acceleration will be there for all. now many effects can't be done with XRENDER i suppose but even with linux, you can't expect Vista-like effects on Win '95-hardware...

Arthur, the Rendering engine in Qt4 is much more capable (and mature) than Cairo, so KDE doesn't have to wait for Cairo to get a decent performance. You're right in the HIG area, tough KDE 4 will have automated usability testing, and use it's framework to get more usability as well. For gnome apps, you had to spend time on problems like 'the icons in Gedit are 2 pixels further from each other than the HIG states'. you don't have such trivial problems in KDE, as the framework dictates such settings. so you can focus on the really important stuff, which hopefully will result in much faster adoption of the HIG than Gnome has been able to pull off.
Also the KDE4 HIG will be more usable for developers, easier to apply with better and more examples than most other HIG's, also speeding up adoption.

Reply Parent Score: 5

rayiner Member since:
2005-07-06

Kwin is build to be able to use XRENDER or OpenGL, so hardware acceleration will be there for all. now many effects can't be done with XRENDER i suppose but even with linux, you can't expect Vista-like effects on Win '95-hardware...

As I said, composited windowing is 2002 level technology. The technologies offered by Vista and Leopard (and even Tiger today) go way beyond that.

Arthur, the Rendering engine in Qt4 is much more capable (and mature) than Cairo, so KDE doesn't have to wait for Cairo to get a decent performance.

Arthur has the same problem Cairo does. If it goes through XRender, it can't do all of Vista's and OS X's pixel-shader based tricks. If it goes through OpenGL directly, it'll hit the DRI stack's limitations on context switching and concurrent rendering.

Reply Parent Score: 3

superstoned Member since:
2005-07-07

well, we're getting more technical than my knowledge can support, but afaik Arthur can have several rendering backends. as a lot of work is going into X.org lately, couldn't that fix this deficit? after all, Zack Russin is put to work on X.org technology and integration with Arthur. In time, they may be able to extend things like XRENDER, AIGLX or other extensions to enable stuff Vista and Mac OS X have as well.

Reply Parent Score: 2

segedunum Member since:
2005-07-06

As I said, composited windowing is 2002 level technology. The technologies offered by Vista and Leopard (and even Tiger today) go way beyond that.

I suppose the root question, as an end user, would be what would the more advanced approach buy me, and would I be able to tell the difference?

Reply Parent Score: 3

archiesteel Member since:
2005-07-02

Arthur has the same problem Cairo does. If it goes through XRender, it can't do all of Vista's and OS X's pixel-shader based tricks.

I followed this discussion and while I understand that Vista has access to some pixel shaders that are trickier to use under Linux, I do wonder how much those pixel shaders are used by Vista, and how much more they bring.

In my experience as end-user, I'm not sure I would notice much difference. What can't be noticed easily will not be missed much, even if it takes a year more to implement...

Seriously, there's stuff in Beryl now that is much ahead of what will be in Vista when it ships. Sure, the technology is better and there'll be third-party add-ons to get all kind of cool effects software, but these will not be available right away, and they won't be part of the default package. If anything, it'll be like a more advanced version WindowBlinds, cool stuff but try to convince your IT department to have it installed on your workstation.

Inless I'm missing something fundamental, it doesn't seem to me that this slight advantage for Vista won't make that much of a difference.

What do I know, anway...I'm just happy to have a hardware-accelerated exposť effect on my Kubuntu laptop. That's more than enough for me! :-)

(I have to admit I'm starting to like the exposť-like function even *more* than virtual desktops...)

Reply Parent Score: 5