Linked by Thom Holwerda on Sat 23rd Dec 2006 17:45 UTC
X11, Window Managers Apparently, my article a few days ago caused a bigger stir than I had anticipated, not at all unrelated to the fact that my wordings may not have been optimal. So, let me clarify things a bit.
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RE[3]: What is this all about?
by Eugenia on Sun 24th Dec 2006 06:04 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: What is this all about?"
Eugenia
Member since:
2005-06-28

I have a much bigger clue than you think I do. But you don't understand what I am talking about. I am talking about INTEGRATION. And in order to do real integration with a DESKTOP SYSTEM, then Gnome/KDE themselves must do this job, to tie a new feature or application with the REST OF THEIR SYSTEM.

This is NOT what an OEM does. This is what the source does (in this case Gnome/KDE). The OEMs simply put things together in a manner that the source allows them to do so, and strap a logo on top. That's not what I am talking about. I am not talking about "adding a jabber client to a random desktop". I am talking about integrating IM to the whole system. I am talking about integrating Bluetooth to the rest of the system.

And besides, adding resolution independence OR handwrite support it is NOT what an OEM/distro does, this is a job for Gnome/KDE themselves.

So, before you come out so rude and tell me that I don't have a clue, please read more carefully as to what I am talking about.

Sorry for not keeping my promise to not reply to this, but your reply was very rude and took the very "simplified" way out. Instead of combating what I AM REALLY talking about, you just came out with a kind of reply that makes you look like you are defensive and you are avoiding the real issue. The real issue is not about "adding an application to the platform", it's about ADDING AND BUILDING AROUND IT. There is a huge difference right there. The one is called OEM'ing (as you correctly stated), and the other one is called ENGINEERING. I am talking about engineering.

> I don't believe GNOME should have a video editor, bluetooth gadgets or Jabber client installed by default. If users need these tools, then they should install it themselves.

You are very wrong here. You are a geek. Geeks don't always want all that, but the point of the matter is, the years pass by and new users need more things. OSX is that great BECAUSE it has a good video editor, integrated AIM and Bluetooth. In fact, ESPECIALLY for Bluetooth, it NEEDS integration with the system, otherwise it just does not work well and usability sucks! Heck, even on Windows third party driver providers integrate their Bluetooth stack with MS Explorer! Integration is KEY for Bluetooth and many-many users NEED it. It's not 1999 anymore.

Edited 2006-12-24 06:08

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[4]: What is this all about?
by tmack on Sun 24th Dec 2006 07:07 in reply to "RE[3]: What is this all about?"
tmack Member since:
2006-04-11

Let me just say: WTF.

Before I thought you didn't have a clue. Now I know you have -1 clues.

You are bouncing all over the place, bitching about random things. Not all of them are unwarranted, but it's still stupid in this context.

"integrating IM to the whole system"

What the hell is the point in saying this? Seriously? Does the volume control applet need to have IM integration functionality? The applications can talk to each other on D-Bus. So if one app needs to have IM integration functionality, it can communicate that way. They're integrated. I'm not sure what you are looking for with this, but it sure as hell sounds retarded.

Reply Parent Score: 1

v RE[5]: What is this all about?
by tmack on Sun 24th Dec 2006 07:29 in reply to "RE[4]: What is this all about?"
RE[4]: What is this all about?
by smitty on Sun 24th Dec 2006 08:03 in reply to "RE[3]: What is this all about?"
smitty Member since:
2005-10-13

I think there is a real split in the Gnome community these days. Some think that Gnome should stay as lean as possible by not adding anything, while others are more like you. I'm afraid those people may be better off moving to OSX or KDE or even Vista because I doubt Gnome will make significant progress in that area when half of it's users don't even want it to.

Reply Parent Score: 2