"In the first head-to-head comparison of trying to accomplish a task with Mac OS and Vista in this series, the new Windows operating system fell flat on its face. Migrating from an XP installation was halted by repeated failures of the Windows Easy Transfer application when used with a network connection and a so-called Easy Transfer Cable. I finally gave up and used Lenovo's System Migration Assistant."
To view parent comment, click here.
To read all comments associated with this story, please click here.
Member since:2005-08-11
Here you are obviously approaching MOSX as if it were Windows or KDE. It is not. If I want to quit an app, I simply quit the app (file=>quit)-or-(apple+q). It takes no more time or less time than closing a window. (file=>close window)-or-(appe+w)-or-(left click the window close button)
It does take more time than just closing a window, if I close the window, and then have to close the app, or I have to take the time to remember to close the app. I am familiar with OS X, and it something that I have never liked, and I have seen lots of new mac users confounded by this behavior.
I believe that this is an instance where one isn't necessarily better than the other--they are just different. IMHO, closing a window does not equal quitting an application. Obviously, you should use which ever system makes most sense to you, but to say one method is "better" is really just catering to your personal taste.
In this instance, I think it is better, due to what I said, it can lead to the app still being open even though there it does not have any windows open, if you can't click on the window, you have to go looking for it, which wastes my time, or my resources if I don't make sure it is closed. It is a matter of personal preference, but in this case, I believe it is slightly more usable the Windows way. Most users intuitivly think that when you close the window, you shutdown the app, I've seen new computer users get confounded by the Mac's behavior in this regard, and it has gotten me, and I know OS X behaves in this fashion. It is by far the most annoying thing about the Mac.
Now don't get me wrong, I think OS X is great, but this is something that I feel should be left up to personal preference, it wouldn't be so hard to give users a choice.
Member since:2006-12-15
It does take more time than just closing a window, if I close the window, and then have to close the app, or I have to take the time to remember to close the app. I am familiar with OS X, and it something that I have never liked, and I have seen lots of new mac users confounded by this behavior.
Why not just quit the app as you intended? (apple+q) is faster than dragging your mouse to the close button. I have seen new PC users confounded by having to relaunch their web browser everytime they want to look at a webpage, or accidentally quiting their program when all they wanted to do was close the window. It goes both ways...
In this instance, I think it is better, due to what I said, it can lead to the app still being open even though there it does not have any windows open, if you can't click on the window, you have to go looking for it, which wastes my time, or my resources if I don't make sure it is closed. It is a matter of personal preference, but in this case, I believe it is slightly more usable the Windows way. Most users intuitivly think that when you close the window, you shutdown the app, I've seen new computer users get confounded by the Mac's behavior in this regard, and it has gotten me, and I know OS X behaves in this fashion. It is by far the most annoying thing about the Mac.
And what exactly is wrong with having an application running with no windows? For example, if you close out your web broswer in Windows you have to go to and look for the application everytime you want to view new content, or are you saying that leaving a running application displaying data is more convenient for your computer's resources? If I close my last remaining window in Safari and move on to a different application, to get back to Safari I have two options: click on it's dock icon or (apple+tab) to it. You can't (apple+tab) or (alt+tab) to an application that isn't running.
I think Mail is a perfect example of having an app running without a window. Unless I'm actually looking at my mail why do I need a window taking up real estate whether it be displayed or minimized to the dock? The Mail dock icon displays any new mail and i get a nice auditory tone when new mail arrives. I can then click on the icon and go from there.
Again, I think it is just a personal preference. Perhaps Apple could make it a configurable item, but I think that that would lead to even more confusion.
Like I said before, I don't think one way is necessarily better than the other, they're just different. Typically, most people tend to prefer to the way they're more familiar.
Member since:
2006-12-15
I find that when you can close an apps window, and still have the app running and it's menu displayed at the top is jarring and time consuming, as after I close the Safari window, I usually have to exit Safari also, as i do not generally think to exit the app, that's what close buttons are for. In Windows and KDE, when I close an apps window, the app is usually closed with it.
Here you are obviously approaching MOSX as if it were Windows or KDE. It is not. If I want to quit an app, I simply quit the app (file=>quit)-or-(apple+q). It takes no more time or less time than closing a window. (file=>close window)-or-(appe+w)-or-(left click the window close button)
The menus for the front-most application remain only for as long as that application remains the front-most application.
If you approach MOSX as if it were Windows, yes you will be frustrated. Believe it or not, here in the US we drive on the right side of the road. In other places in the world, such as England they drive on the left side of the road. While there are simularities between driving in the US and England, if you attempt to drive in England like you do in the US, you will be frustrated.
Which is clumsier? I think it's OS X, as closing all an app's windows should make the app exit, imho. This can lead to having apps running in the background that you think are closed, but are actually still running, eating resources.
I believe that this is an instance where one isn't necessarily better than the other--they are just different. IMHO, closing a window does not equal quitting an application. Obviously, you should use which ever system makes most sense to you, but to say one method is "better" is really just catering to your personal taste.
The menu bar on most apps do not take up a enough space to be a problem, especially with the screen real estate available with todays hi-res displays. toolbars, now that is another matter, but I digress
I honestly don't have a problem with most menu bars whether they be Mac style, Windows style, etc... There are some crazy toolbars out there though...
Edited 2007-02-13 19:25