Linked by Thom Holwerda on Sat 17th Feb 2007 18:45 UTC, submitted by GhePeU
X11, Window Managers David Reveman writes: "I'd like to get all of you updated on the compiz related things discussed at the X developer conference that was held last week. My talk was mainly focused on 'what's next' and how to get desktop compositing in X to the next level." He also discussed the fork: "I had the chance to talk to Quinn Storm from the beryl project during xdevconf. I would have hoped that the current situation with beryl could be improved but it seems like Quinn at least isn't interested in that. However, after talking to Quinn it's very clear to me that the fork was partially motivated by assumptions that were wrong."
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RE[4]: sour grapes?
by n0xx on Sun 18th Feb 2007 03:17 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: sour grapes?"
n0xx
Member since:
2005-07-12

"Once more into the breach my friends.."

Whether or not Beryl is using hacks to accomplish some of its effects is irrelevant.

No it 's not.

What's obviously at issue is the Compiz folks are pissed off about the fork.

And rightfully so... Fist and foremost the fork happened for all the wrong reasons... lies and personal rivalry.

Now, the fork has moved ahead and fanned out in directions Compiz hasn't yet gone, the compiz devs are making sure they point out every flaw in Beryl while at the same time using stability and "doing it right" as their own excuse for being slow.

I dare you to come up with a list of 10 features that are only available on beryl and not on compiz. (ok, i'll five you the snow animation as an head start ;) )

Then, i dare you to make a list of all the bugs you'll find beryl but not in compiz.

Edited 2007-02-18 03:35

Reply Parent Score: 5

RE[5]: sour grapes?
by Yagami on Sun 18th Feb 2007 17:00 in reply to "RE[4]: sour grapes?"
Yagami Member since:
2006-07-15

er ... do you really want that list ?!

and i am sorry , but i dont use compiz because i use beryl.
if beryl didnt exist , i would use kwin !

i do apreciate and respect D.R. and hope he continues to work in X development , but as compiz ( window manager / composite manager ) goes , it sucks!

its not beryl's fault... compiz just sucks

plus , i dunno why is this mentality of "beryl will become obsolete , metisse will become obsolete " ( read the forums , its in there ). Are you guys seeing too much Star Trek Borg episodes ?
this users will over time choose compiz , and beryl will die mentality... boy oh boy

just to remind you of something : wrong ... i for one , will choose kde4 , no matter if beryl dies or not

for someone who is mostly unbiased , and respects both side's work ( at least the very important and tecnological work of David r. ) , reading your forum and blog posts just makes you look like angry geeks

Reply Parent Score: -1

RE[6]: sour grapes?
by kondzior.p@gmail.com on Sun 18th Feb 2007 18:50 in reply to "RE[5]: sour grapes?"
kondzior.p@gmail.com Member since:
2007-02-18

Yeah i really want that list ;)

So you thnik Compiz sucks ? Well beryl is fork of compiz... and after fork it still syncs compiz code so you shuld now say BERYL sucks too, because 99 % beryl "core" code is still compiz code, there ware no significantly changes. And the almost all users and developers of beryl dont say nothing about that in official statments or official discussion (this disscussion is good example). Only poison ;) and personal attacks, Star Trek ? angry geeks ? so i this is your technical arguments ? constructive comments ?

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[5]: sour grapes?
by segedunum on Sun 18th Feb 2007 22:29 in reply to "RE[4]: sour grapes?"
segedunum Member since:
2005-07-06

No it 's not.

I don't see how it isn't irrelevant to an end user. As long as Beryl works, an end user doesn't care. Besides, if you look at both Beryl and Compiz they both use a bunch of hacks and neither are particularly stable for anyone to use on a day to day basis. The notion that Compiz has clean code, does things right and is stable is just laughable. If that was the case everyone would be using it. They're not.

And rightfully so... Fist and foremost the fork happened for all the wrong reasons... lies and personal rivalry.

Right. Do we have some evidence for that, otherwise this is someone just being pissed for the sake of it and doing what open source has always been about? Additionally, some people are just pissed at the attention that Beryl has got.

I dare you to come up with a list of 10 features that are only available on beryl and not on compiz. (ok, i'll five you the snow animation as an head start ;) )

So why should the above concern you or anyone else then? ;-)

Then, i dare you to make a list of all the bugs you'll find beryl but not in compiz.

Both Beryl and Compiz are buggy. Compiz is by no means a bastion of stability.

Edited 2007-02-18 22:34

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[6]: sour grapes?
by apoclypse on Mon 19th Feb 2007 01:21 in reply to "RE[5]: sour grapes?"
apoclypse Member since:
2007-02-17

Its not laughable, its closer to the truth than you think. The truth is that compiz when first created was a proof of concept, a prototype showing how a compositing manager should be implemented. The project took off and quinnstorm really needs credit for that as a lot of interest stemmed from that compiz branch. the issue is that regardless of what teh end user thinks, this isn't closed source software where the end justifies the means. Opensource software isn't afraid to rewrite a huge amounts of code just to clean it up, instead of piling hacks upon hacks. Beryl is hackish, it uses hacks to get things kind of working, but not properly and the real end result is that unlike compiz other window managers can't benefit from the work done in beryl. the patches the Dave is adding to the xserver will benefit any window manager that needs it not just compiz. Thats important and it shows you how selfish the beryl project has been. The licensing being the most major screw up.

Reply Parent Score: 2