Linked by Thom Holwerda on Wed 14th Mar 2007 22:10 UTC
Gnome "Today, the GNOME Project celebrates the release of GNOME 2.18, the latest version of the popular, multi-platform Free desktop environment." The GNOME 2.18 start page has all the details, such as release notes, download locations, and screenshots.
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RE[4]: You know what I miss?
by leos on Thu 15th Mar 2007 15:23 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: You know what I miss?"
leos
Member since:
2005-09-21

KDE 4 is very broken today (is pre-alpha the official definition?). GNOME will most likely never be in that state again.

So you're saying the system architecture of Gnome 2.x is the ultimate possible, and will never need to change? Sorry, but if you want to make something better in a fundamental way, you have to break it first. Either that or create a lot of compatibility layers to keep the old API, and only Microsoft has the resources to do that.

Reply Parent Score: 5

RE[5]: You know what I miss?
by thebluesgnr on Thu 15th Mar 2007 18:03 in reply to "RE[4]: You know what I miss?"
thebluesgnr Member since:
2005-11-14

So you're saying the system architecture of Gnome 2.x is the ultimate possible, and will never need to change? Sorry, but if you want to make something better in a fundamental way, you have to break it first. Either that or create a lot of compatibility layers to keep the old API, and only Microsoft has the resources to do that.

That's not exactly what I'm saying. GNOME will replace components of the platform, but without breaking the entire stack while they're at it. In fact, it's been doing that for a long while now (see Project Ridley, D-Bus, gvfs).

The D-Bus adoption is a perfect example. GNOME adopted D-Bus without breaking anything.

gnome-vfs is not perfect and will be replaced by gvfs, which is being developed. But GNOME will not depend on gvfs until it's ready; that's the main difference in strategy between the current development model of KDE and GNOME. KDE decided to fix its entire platform in one go, while GNOME is incrementally replacing components as the next generation ones are completed and ready to go.

Of course, supporting gnome-vfs and gvfs, ORBit/Bonobo and D-Bus, etc, is not a lifetime solution, which is why the old libraries will eventually become unsupported and the platform released as version 3.0.

Btw, GTK+ adopted Cairo without having to break its API, but that's because GTK+ was well designed to begin with.

Reply Parent Score: 5

RE[6]: You know what I miss?
by leos on Thu 15th Mar 2007 18:49 in reply to "RE[5]: You know what I miss?"
leos Member since:
2005-09-21

The D-Bus adoption is a perfect example. GNOME adopted D-Bus without breaking anything.

Yes, this worked because Gnome didn't have an equivalent to d-bus before d-bus came along. You can add a feature without breaking anything quite easily. In fact, KDE did the exact same thing. Some components of KDE in the 3.5 series use d-bus, and it didn't require any major changes.

What KDE is doing in version 4 is quite different. They are _replacing_ their dcop implementation with d-bus. This requires breakage. Sure, they could just add d-bus support and keep dcop as well, but now you're dragging along two IPC frameworks that you have to maintain, and expose interfaces to, and load into memory. From a development standpoint, it is far better to migrate to the new framework and drop the old one.

gnome-vfs is not perfect and will be replaced by gvfs, which is being developed. But GNOME will not depend on gvfs until it's ready; that's the main difference in strategy between the current development model of KDE and GNOME.

Since when does KDE depend on technologies that aren't ready? KDE 4 is a development version, just like the next development version of Gnome will depend on technologies that are not currently ready. They will be ready on release date.

Of course, supporting gnome-vfs and gvfs, ORBit/Bonobo and D-Bus, etc, is not a lifetime solution, which is why the old libraries will eventually become unsupported and the platform released as version 3.0.

Bingo. And this will cause breakage. So how is this different from the KDE 4 situation? The only difference is that the decision to break compatibility comes at a different point.

Reply Parent Score: 5