Linked by Thom Holwerda on Sat 25th Aug 2007 19:56 UTC, submitted by AdamW
Mandriva, Mandrake, Lycoris The second beta of Mandriva Linux 2008, codenamed Galilee, is now available. The release notes are available here. A guide to major new features (some of which are not yet implemented in this beta) is available here, and the detailed technical specifications are available here. This beta is available as a three CD or one DVD Free edition (containing no non-free software or drivers) for the x86-32 and x86-64 architectures, with a traditional installer. Future betas will be available in One live/install CD hybrid editions with proprietary drivers.
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Fred's policy on GNOME is to follow upstream GNOME as closely as possible. Hence we followed their change in the default panel layout.

We cannot have any official links to PLF. It contains software that's simply flat out illegal in major jurisdictions (most obviously dvdcss and win32-codecs) and hence we can't be associated with it.

Mandriva's GCC packages already use the Debian alternatives system (which we use whenever we want to have various alternative versions or implementations of the same command available). You can install GCC 3.3 and even 2.96 alongside the current version (packages gcc3.3 and gcc2.96) and then use the different versions in several ways: you can either explicitly call gcc3.3 or gcc2.96 , define the CC variable, or use update-alternatives:

update-alternatives --config gcc

(as root) and tell it which one you want to be the default.

I don't know anything about Giza++. But in general, it's very hard to ensure that obsolete software that is not updated by its authors will work with a modern distribution.

Reply Parent Score: 3

djame Member since:

at least for dvdcss it's obviously not illegal under european law. About win32 codec, I concur.

about update alternative, the compilation is not that hard, having two sets of library compiled for one or the other of compiler maybe a bit tricky. But it's good to know it exists. it's just a pity that this command is not listed at the end of man gcc, for exemple. How could we find about this command ?

About what you called obsolote software, i simply don't agree at all.
You assume all programs should be upgraded whenever someone came with another library or api or whatever is the trend of the moment. But the kind of software scientists use are really costly to developp and yet to maintain especially if one version compiles fine and run fine for ten years.
Backward compatabilities should be the only thing that matters for an os seller, you can't just trhough the baby and the water of the bath at the same time.
Even If I don't agree, i can see the point for binaries compatabilities, but if a program is open source and uses posix call and no gcc trick, it shoud compile right under any new version. For Giza++ (, simply the state of the art for text alignement for those interested) it works right from gcc 2.96 to gcc 3.3 and I can see no reason why it doesn't under new version of a given distro.
I've always been told that source compatability was the rule and it's simply not true under linux world.

Why people should develop for an unix like OS if it's not likely to be compatible in a few years ? that's why we may see more and more acceptance of real unix (like solaris, or os x which maintains binary compatabilities even over change of processor not talking about different favor (from 10.0 to 10.5, everything is source compatible) where all sources are compilable without any problems.

I was told that LSB was the way to go to prevent such a thing, but it simply don't work.

To go back talking about binary proprietary software, if a compagny has to change and provide binary for every damn distro, kernel version, library version, it's just can't work.
Think about the state of the games which have been developped by Loki. I wonder how many of them (except ut and quake 3) can run on a modern distro. It's just a shame : I can't order descent 3 and pay for it without having to work for hours to get it work on mandriva 2007 (to be honest, any of a new distro will have the same problem).
And it's simply not normal. I shouldn't loose my investment when I upgrade my distro.
It's not a new argument, look at joel spolky's "how microsoft lost the api war".
If you want to be different from fedora, ubuntu and suse allow us to use the software we paid, we developped or we were trained just by having to install some metapackage like "bin compat" "gcc3 compat" or whatever you call it and please include this information when the dynamic linker failed
not " not found. "
but " not found. This library is part of the package "bin compat". do you want to install the missing library ? [y/N]

yes, pure science fiction, I know, but not too hard if your dependencdy database is well done.

Sorry if I'm long, but It's nice to exchange with someone from the "inside" ;)


Reply Parent Score: 3

AdamW Member since:

Looking at that page, GIZA++ hasn't been updated since 2003. There have been several major GCC revisions since then. It's simply not practical to stay on a version of GCC that works for this and maybe a couple of other old apps (3.3?) by default, and introduce huge difficulties in building more widely used and up-to-date software which is now targeting GCC 4.

A distributor's job is always going to involve trade offs. In this case, I'm afraid, there's just more benefits overall to defaulting to GCC 4 than GCC 3.

Reply Parent Score: 4

AdamW Member since:

Forgot to mention: dvdcss would most likely be illegal under the EUCD, which like the U.S.'s DMCA, contains a clause forbidding the circumvention of copy protection mechanisms - even for legitimate purposes. So it's very likely illegal in any E.U. state which has already passed a national law implementing the EUCD (as they are all bound to).

Reply Parent Score: 3