Linked by Thom Holwerda on Thu 27th Sep 2007 07:55 UTC, submitted by Augusto
Novell and Ximian "Two months ago, the Brazilian Linux community gathered around BR-Linux invited Novell to answer 10 questions sent and selected by the users, about the company's stance on Linux, open source, licenses, document formats and other subjects." "Novell has been very consistent on this issue and we have publicly stated that we do not believe that Linux infringes on any Microsoft patents. That being said, our agreement with Microsoft takes the patent issue off the table for customers. We have simply made the patent issue a non-event as part of a customer buying decision."
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RE[5]: patents
by segedunum on Thu 27th Sep 2007 21:07 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: patents"
segedunum
Member since:
2005-07-06

Again, false by experience. Look how many customers Novell gained when they got it. When you've got billions of dollars (Wal-Mart, etc) then you're a big target. Having a _guarantee_ is a huge help.

I'm sorry to burst your bubble, but these companies now firmly believe that Microsoft protection money is necessary when Novell has admitted that it isn't necessary - firmly cementing the impression that Microsoft wants to give. Microsoft now have Novell firmly by the balls.

Those deals are firmly at the behest of Novell's biggest competitor - Microsoft.

If you weren't so bent on taking the customer patent protection negatively...

If you're a Novell customer and you get one of these letters through your door it doesn't reassure you at all. It just gives you the impression that Novell have been silly and Microsoft's patent protection is necessary. You then start to wonder what Novell are actually selling you.

That's what _some_ vocal "poisonous" people in the OSS community have been saying.

Hmmmm. So people who point out the obvious impression that this deal gives, namely that Linux and open source software infringes on Microsoft's property, these people are poisonous are they? Novell have admitted themselves that that isn't the case, but Microsoft have been going around saying it anyway. This deal has given Microsoft ample fuel for the fire they wanted to create - and Novell handed them some lovely firewood.

The reality is the direct opposite.

Yer, black is the new white.

If you think this is something new then _you_ are being exceptionally naive. MS have been spreading FUD about Linux for years; this is old news. Trying to bend the Novell-MS deal to be negative...

The fact of the matter is that this deal has helped Microsoft's FUD offensive on Linux and open source software immensely. Squirming and trying to tell us that Microsoft has been using FUD for years, so a little bit more won't hurt, is just exceptionally silly.

A payment is suddenly bad because it's one-off? It wasn't exactly a small payment either.

Yer I know. It kept them in the black ;-).

Novell have got _plenty_ in the way of interoperability with virtualisation and document formats.

So what have the got from Microsoft exactly? Improvements to Samba? Nope. Samba is continuing as it always has. Dedicated help in implementing OOXML and interoperability with Office? Nope. They're merely implementing what everyone else can. Is Xen the only virtualisation option that can run Windows? Nope, VMware has been doing that for years.

So where is this interoperability they keep telling us about?

I've never heard this, but even if it's the case, I'm interested in hearing why you think this could possibly be negative.

Errrr, because several times the server numbers of their nearest and most direct competitor are being sold along with them?

Adoption of Linux in a company is suddenly bad if they want to choose to keep using Windows servers as well? Come on guy. :-)

It is if as part of the deal that they're having to buy into several times the numbers of Windows servers as Linux ones.

Your post pretty much sums up the naivety and stupidity of Novell over the years.

Reply Parent Score: 5

RE[6]: patents
by sanctus on Fri 28th Sep 2007 15:46 in reply to "RE[5]: patents"
sanctus Member since:
2005-08-31

Hmmmm. So people who point out the obvious impression that this deal gives, namely that Linux and open source software infringes on Microsoft's property, these people are poisonous are they? Novell have admitted themselves that that isn't the case, but Microsoft have been going around saying it anyway. This deal has given Microsoft ample fuel for the fire they wanted to create - and Novell handed them some lovely firewood.


This is what matter most. They politically said ( it's not a pragmatic programmer literature where the exact meaning of the sentence is the clear answer), maybe we used Microsoft patent, maybe we will also lose in court, so even if we think and say we dont, we'll take no chance and give them (Microsoft) what they want.

I think Novell should split mono in two parts. First, they have two incompatibles goals. [Mono provides the necessary software to develop and run .NET client and server applications on Linux, Solaris, Mac OS X, Windows, and Unix ....] AND […. positioned to become the leading choice for development of Linux applications.] http://www.mono-project.com/Main_Page

The first one is a corporate goal to lower cost of software migration to other OS. The other one involve creating a community that use there tool to build free solution. A community that want open standard without patent restriction. But yet Novell promote the use of ADO.net and ASP.net even if they explaining in there FAQs that they’re patents restricted technologies. [… potential issues that might arise with ASP.NET, ADO.NET or Windows.Forms]

My solution would be to make all the microsoft high level blocks ship as a separated package for .net interoperability. and sign an agreement -only- on that part, even charge for it. This would satisfy the first goal without compromising the second one.

Then, Novell/mono should encourage open source new technologies base on the CLI. Which is a great technology, combine with the boo language, I would probably jump in. Anyway, solution like Django or pylons are superior of ASP.net, sqlalchemy or db4o is also a step forward ADO.net and wxsharp and gtk are quality substitute for winform. Mono needs the community to perceive them as a technology innovator and not a submissive follower where using they’re product is a potential danger.

Reply Parent Score: 1