Linked by Thom Holwerda on Mon 19th Nov 2007 21:22 UTC, submitted by irbis
Window Managers "Linux has proven amazingly flexible: after nearly 10 years of use, I'm still impressed by how the Linux operating system does exactly what I want on any type of hardware. Desktop customization is no exception; from the ultra-modern KDE and GNOME window managers to with the likes of Fluxbox and AfterStep, there's a Linux desktop to suit everyone."
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RE: Choice
by lemur2 on Tue 20th Nov 2007 09:30 UTC in reply to "Choice"
lemur2
Member since:
2007-02-17

To windows users - rather than look for a reason to use Linux, try the approach of trying Linux for a while (try PCLinuxOS live CD), try the different DE's and try to find reasons to use windows. Give Linux a good, serious try - you may find a pleasant surprise


I remain quite mystified about the apparent attitude of Windows supporters towards Linux.

Linux has a longish list of important advantages and cost savings and "lack of hassle" time savings for the users over Windows ... yet Windows users seem to be in denial about that, and seem desperate to try to put down Linux and bolster Windows ... and one has to ask to what end?

Do they actually want to hand over their hard-earned money to Redmond year after year for no good reason? Do they really want to yield control over their own hardware and their own IT spending to a large American corporation of known untrustworthiness? Do they really want to spend considerable time, effort and money constantly trying to keep their systems secure? Do they really want to be dependent on the whims of one foreign firm to continue to have access to their own digital data? Do they like being spied upon and dictated to? Do they want to be inundated with obnoxious advertising and spam?

Exactly what gives with all that anyway?

One suspects there is some mis-representation here of what genuine computer users actually think.

Can we mention the word "astroturfing" perhaps?

Edited 2007-11-20 09:35

Reply Parent Score: 5

RE[2]: Choice
by Thom_Holwerda on Tue 20th Nov 2007 12:35 in reply to "RE: Choice"
Thom_Holwerda Member since:
2005-06-29

Linux has a longish list of important advantages and cost savings and "lack of hassle" time savings for the users over Windows ... yet Windows users seem to be in denial about that, and seem desperate to try to put down Linux and bolster Windows ... and one has to ask to what end?


Maybe because they simply LIKE Windows? Not everyone shares an interest in openness and more of that stuff - for them, Windows is what they know, and despite its shortcomings, it's what they like. Can you please LEAVE it at that, instead of trying to make it seem as if Windows users are complete idiots? Stop generalising, lemur, it's REALLY starting to work on my nerves.

And I even find it offensive. I had my parents try Linux for a few weeks, and they simply DID NOT LIKE IT. Can't you just accept that?

Do they actually want to hand over their hard-earned money to Redmond year after year for no good reason?


Year over year? My parents bought Windows XP 5 years ago, and Windows 2000 8 years ago, and they're still using them. What is this "year over year"?

Do they really want to yield control over their own hardware and their own IT spending to a large American corporation of known untrustworthiness?


Oh, cut the nonsense already. Microsoft is no worse than any of the other big companies of the world - what car do you drive? Do you really think Toyota or GM is any better than Microsoft, or any other company? Yet you easily trust those, and step into their cars every day.

Do they really want to spend considerable time, effort and money constantly trying to keep their systems secure?


No they don't, and so they don't do it. The machines are set up YEARS ago, once every year or so I do some maintenance, and that's it. No virus, no spyware, nothing.

Do they really want to be dependent on the whims of one foreign firm to continue to have access to their own digital data?


Cry me a river. We're not all paranoid.

Do they like being spied upon and dictated to?


Spied upon? Dictated to? In what world do you live?

Do they want to be inundated with obnoxious advertising and spam?


You mean like your comments on OSNews?

One suspects there is some mis-representation here of what genuine computer users actually think.


Sure, everybody else is wrong, and you are right. Maybe, just maybe, it's YOU who is wrong? No, that couldn't be, could it? I mean, you use Linux!

Can we mention the word "astroturfing" perhaps?


Yes. That's that thing you are doing.

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[3]: Choice
by lemur2 on Tue 20th Nov 2007 12:56 in reply to "RE[2]: Choice"
lemur2 Member since:
2007-02-17

And I even find it offensive. I had my parents try Linux for a few weeks, and they simply DID NOT LIKE IT. Can't you just accept that?


Sure I can. The question is, can you accept that many people DO NOT LIKE Windows, especially Windows Vista, and they are looking for a way out?

Many, many people feel more than a little "trapped" by Windows, and Windows file formats and other lock-in mechanisms built in to Windows, and they are looking for an alternative but fearful of the unknown.

Year over year? My parents bought Windows XP 5 years ago, and Windows 2000 8 years ago, and they're still using them. What is this "year over year"?


They do not want to have to pay someone every six months or so, over and over again, to "clean" or "re-install" their broken Windows systems for them, but they feel they must if they want to keep operating.

I myself have "cleaned" many a Windows system (for free) just in order to help people I know out. Many people do not have access to a friend who can do this for them.

These people typically do not know there is a perfectly viable, usable, functional, free system available to them, that will work on their systems.

It is a dis-service to pretend to such people that they do not have a way out, and that this thing called "Linux" is no good, and cannot help them, when in reality it can.

So, despite the fact that it may annoy you, Thom, (and I am sorry if it does but one just has to respond to disinformation) it is my hope that by posting here I might be able to get this message through to people, despite the naysayers, and help some of them out.

Edited 2007-11-20 13:01

Reply Parent Score: 6

RE[3]: Choice
by netpython on Tue 20th Nov 2007 12:57 in reply to "RE[2]: Choice"
netpython Member since:
2005-07-06

Windows is a necessity if you develop windows applications. Windows is a necessity if that's what you know. Windows is a necessity if you like it. Windows is a necessity if you reverse engineer windows applications, for whatever reason. Windows is not a necessity if you want to play the latest game titles.

OpenSource is a necessity if you rather prefer updates as soon as possible instead of monthly patch cycles.

0day exposure:

http://research.eeye.com/html/alerts/zeroday/index.html

Anyway i think you should address the thread highjackers as well Thom. Who started the: "My d&ck is larger then yours ." provocations.

Reply Parent Score: 5

RE[2]: Choice
by BluenoseJake on Tue 20th Nov 2007 12:58 in reply to "RE: Choice"
BluenoseJake Member since:
2005-08-11

"Linux has a longish list of important advantages and cost savings and "lack of hassle" time savings for the users over Windows ... yet Windows users seem to be in denial about that, and seem desperate to try to put down Linux and bolster Windows ... and one has to ask to what end? "

I got a couple of problems with this statement:

1. I don't think there is any "lack of hassle" with Linux. The hassles are different, but they are there. I use both, and have never really noticed a big difference in tinkering time between Windows XP and Linux. Luckily, problems with either are the exception, not the norm.

2. Most Windows users couldn't care less about Linux or about bolstering Windows, they just want their stuff to work, so they can get back to downloading porn.

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[3]: Choice
by lemur2 on Tue 20th Nov 2007 13:07 in reply to "RE[2]: Choice"
lemur2 Member since:
2007-02-17

Most Windows users couldn't care less about Linux or about bolstering Windows, they just want their stuff to work


Yep. Many of them will pay for subscription to an anti-virus vendor, to keep their systems working. Some of them will call Windows help to try to get their system back to working, and spend hours frustrated because they can't get it sorted that way.

Some people are savvy and smart, and can keep a Windows system clean and going well indefinitely. Good luck to them.

Most people are lumbered with having to take their machines back to the shop every so often in order to keep them working.

Reply Parent Score: 4

RE[3]: Choice
by apoclypse on Tue 20th Nov 2007 14:28 in reply to "RE[2]: Choice"
apoclypse Member since:
2007-02-17

Yeah, but downloading p0rn is so much safer and easier on linux. Don't they understand that? Someone has to show these sticky hand fools what's up.

Reply Parent Score: 2