Linked by Thom Holwerda on Thu 6th Dec 2007 16:27 UTC
Mac OS X Since my Cube could not run Leopard, and I did not have any other Macs, I was unable to delve into Leopard right away. Apple NL was kind enough to fix this problem for us, by generously loaning me a brand new MacBook with Leopard installed so I could review it for OSNews. Read on for the findings.
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RE: Stationary
by kaiwai on Thu 6th Dec 2007 20:41 UTC in reply to "Stationary"
kaiwai
Member since:
2005-07-06

I think this stems from some sort of elitist holdover from some core geeks who believe email should remain plain text only. I happen to use plain text email, but the fact is that the rest of the world uses it differently, and it is very useful to have things embedded.


It has nothing to do with elitism. It has to do with the fact that it is bloat; what does it add to the conversation by the fact that the mail has 40 different types of fonts used for a 4 line email? nothing is achieved. Infact, the clarity is made worse and quite frankly, within an enterprise setting, its yet more features which distract the end user from the core purpose of email.

I've received html emails, and I'm on a metered internet connection, every bit of garbage added to the email by virtue of their 'creative juices' - it costs me. Run a USENET server with, in some cases, groups with 20,000 articles; imagine if each one was HTML, and added another 2K to the article, thats another 40MB, then over a server with 50,000 news groups - it makes it even worse.

Its the old story of 'look after the pennies and the pounds will take care of themselves' - by themselves they aren't bad but imagine when it is extrapolated over several hundreds of thousands of end users.

THose of us who hate HTML email (along with USENET) don't hate it because it makes things interesting, we hate it because people completely lose the plot on what is acceptable to send, and what isn't. Give the end user an inch, and they'll take a mile.

Reply Parent Score: 6

RE[2]: Stationary
by Adam S on Thu 6th Dec 2007 20:45 in reply to "RE: Stationary"
Adam S Member since:
2005-04-01

Meh. A few people abuse it, so wipe it out for everyone everywhere.

Your response is essentially "users are too dumb to know any better (than I do), so let's take it away from them." That's elitist in my book.

ps. I've never in my life seen an emal with 40 fonts. 99% of HTML email I receive is one font, one background. Hardly the mess you're painting.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[3]: Stationary
by kaiwai on Thu 6th Dec 2007 21:16 in reply to "RE[2]: Stationary"
kaiwai Member since:
2005-07-06

Meh. A few people abuse it, so wipe it out for everyone everywhere.


Of course, what benefit does it add for YOU? nothing, absolutely nothing. Is it necessary to change the fonts - does it some how magically change or improve your email? of course not!

I receive emails for information purposes. I get an email to inform me of something; how the email looks by way of font, colour, layout or what not has no impact; infact, if you send me a candy coated email that looks like a teeny bopper has written it, it goes instantly into the trash.

Your response is essentially "users are too dumb to know any better (than I do), so let's take it away from them." That's elitist in my book.


Yes, users are dumb. For some here they seem to have never gone through the stark realisation of the world as it is. Most people hit it when they're 19, sometimes in their mid twenties, and in my case, when I was 9. Realising that the world isn't so fabulous; basically that moment when life crushes ones own spirit.

A realisation that people are morons, and it isnt elitist, it being a realist. Look around you, we have people who have children who can barely support themselves - then they turn around and demand hand outs from the government. We have people know full well what the cause of obesity is but think its because of everything else besides eating too much and doing too little exercise.

So no, I'm not an elitist, just observing mans ability to take stupidity to all new lows, and worse, the seemly celebration of ignorance which popular culture seems to perpetuate.

ps. I've never in my life seen an emal with 40 fonts. 99% of HTML email I receive is one font, one background. Hardly the mess you're painting.


Then obviously you haven't been out for long. I've seen HTML not only utilised, but abused on a mass scale. Its like going from being a moderate gamer to the gamer who plays a game for 70 hours straight (and then subsequently dies - occurred in Korea to a young lad)

Reply Parent Score: 6

RE[3]: Stationary
by MamiyaOtaru on Fri 7th Dec 2007 00:50 in reply to "RE[2]: Stationary"
MamiyaOtaru Member since:
2005-11-11

Meh. A few people abuse it, so wipe it out for everyone everywhere.

I would support such an initiative.

This whole thing might make an interesting separate thread, with a poll. I'd be voting for "hate html mail and would prefer never to receive any ever again."

Spam uses a large chunk of bandwidth. The use of HTML mail makes it more than twice as large as it needs to be. The same can be said for the many legitimate messages that go around. They are using more than double the bandwidth they need to. It doesn't hurt too much with a single message, but email and spam is never "a single message."

HTML mail is especially aggravating when it's sent to a mailing list whose archives can be browsed online. Odds are it won't be rendered correctly for people browsing the archive, and is therefore mostly useless (not to mention it will most likely simply be ignored.)

Finally, there are still folks who use the console for lots of stuff, including reading email. HTML email is an impediment.

Some of these reasons obviously aren't going to apply to you (console email client) but some at least apply to everyone (mountains of bandwidth). Even if you don't agree you at least have to see where people are coming from when they dislike it.

I too refuse to read HTML formatted email. If my livelihood depended on email (and replying to every single message) I might rethink that, but in the meantime I'm very happy to discourage its use. For the good of the internet or something.

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[2]: Stationary
by Sabon on Thu 6th Dec 2007 21:38 in reply to "RE: Stationary"
Sabon Member since:
2005-07-06

You are complaining about bloat in e-mails and yet you have your picture in your posts. What's up with that?

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[3]: Stationary
by kaiwai on Thu 6th Dec 2007 21:54 in reply to "RE[2]: Stationary"
kaiwai Member since:
2005-07-06

You choose to look at this website, you don't choose whether or not an html email is downloaded, you don't choose whether or not HTML messages are posted to an USENET server.

In a USENET, you're forced to download all the messages, HTML and plain text. When you download your email, you download the whole lot at once, again, no choice in process.

When you view this site, you choose to go to the website, you choose to view HTML, you make all those choices yourself. If everytime an HTML email was sent to me, I was given an option to delete the file before it is downloaded, you would be right, but that isn't the case.

Reply Parent Score: 1