A huge 'discussion' took place on the desktop-devel mailing list of the GNOME project about a possible replacement for TomBoy, the Wiki-like note taking application-thing-program-utility written in Mono - it being written in Mono was the prime reason for the whole debate, which started here, and only got considerably nastier later on. "It would seem that lately there are a lot of FUD-spreading trolls crawling out of the woodwork trying to frighten people into thinking that GNOME somehow depends on Mono. Let's take a look at their most widely repeated claims."
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Member since:2005-07-06
Member since:2006-03-29
I guess then Java, Python, Perl, etc also qualify for this argument granted they are not from Microsoft. If I install Gnome, it pulls in Python and Perl. I personally would have preferred if they kept to simple C for all the stuff but there are many who don't agree with me 
Member since:2007-10-12
I don't think that anyone can honestly compare Perl or Python to Mono in terms of simplicity or bloated runtime. Perl code isn't even byte-compiled last I checked.
However, I think Java completely blows. But which Gnome apps use it? None. I've been using and programming on Linux for 12 years now, and I have never installed a Java runtime. Python and Perl (though Perl code is fugly) are very useful, fairly simple, quick, and well-suited for many tasks. Not at all like Mono/C#. If it can be done in C#, it can be done much better in C or C++. C# is like "C++ for Dummies". If you can't handle thinking about pointers and memory management, you shouldn't be writing application code.
Member since:2007-07-25
To be honest I think this whole mess could be sorted out by embracing Java and actually put a real effort into making it a great alternative. For enterprise people either use .NET or Java. Thats a fact, and by pushing python, perl, <insert any other weird flavor of language here>, rather than Java people WILL use the best supported language of the two enterprise languages...that being C#.NET and therefore Mono, because at least Miguel seems to have figured out that people will use what's best supported of these two.
This is not a matter of opinion really. What the end user and the hobby programmer prefers are irrelevant unfortunately. Java is the most used programming language in the world (and therefore has the largest potential to attract new programmers to the platform), but as I understand C# and .NET are gaining market at a rapid speed.
Member since:2006-08-17
[quote]I guess then Java, Python, Perl, etc also qualify for this argument granted they are not from Microsoft. If I install Gnome, it pulls in Python and Perl. I personally would have preferred if they kept to simple C for all the stuff but there are many who don't agree with me 
[/quote]
I definitely agree with you.
But my opinion is that although python is nice, I don't like it when people use python as an excuse run away from C and make their work easier to complete.
Member since:2005-11-12
Member since:2005-11-12
Writing a simple note-taking app with Mono is like using a jackhammer to kill cockroaches.
Nicely stated. That cracked me up. But couldn't the same be said about Java? You can write a simple note-taking application with it but something like Python or C with GTK toolkit would be a faster and slimmer route. I like to use Java for server side code but using it for GUI work is awkward. The apps just never perform the same as native GTK.
Edited 2008-02-27 02:59 UTC
Member since:2008-02-22
Nicely stated. That cracked me up. But couldn't the same be said about Java? You can write a simple note-taking application with it but something like Python or C with GTK toolkit would be a faster and slimmer route. I like to use Java for server side code but using it for GUI work is awkward. The apps just never perform the same as native GTK.
Indeed the same could be said about Java.
One problem with writing apps in Python is that they typically use more memory and are slower than the same apps written in C#.
I will give you this tho... C# isn't as much of a step in the RAD direction as Python is... Dare I say that IronPython is the best of both worlds? Faster runtime and faster development time ;-)
Member since:2007-07-25
You do realize that GTK is GTK nomatter what language is used? Its not like the gtk_main() is reimplemented using Java: GTK itself is still native!
Besides...Java comes close to native performance. Sure you can still say that Swing is slow, which I agree, but then its no longer a discussion about GTK but about Swing.
Edited 2008-02-27 08:40 UTC
Member since:
2007-10-12
Well, some people don't care that it's a "Microsoft technology" and simply don't like Mono because it's huge, bloated, over-engineered and completely unnecessary. It's like a great big middle finger raised at the beauty and simplicity of the Unix tradition. A tradition that Linux is, unfortunately, slowly sliding away from. Writing a simple note-taking app with Mono is like using a jackhammer to kill cockroaches. It may work, but it's not even close to the right tool for the job.