Linked by Thom Holwerda on Fri 21st Mar 2008 21:49 UTC
Editorial "I used KDE as my primary desktop from 1996 through 2006, when I installed the GNOME version of Ubuntu and found that I liked it better than the KDE desktop I'd faced every morning for so many years. Last January, I got a new Dell Latitude D630 laptop and decided to install Kubuntu on it, but within a few weeks, I went back to GNOME. Does this mean GNOME is now a better desktop than KDE, or just that I have become so accustomed to GNOME that it's hard for me to give it up?"
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RE[2]: Kubuntus fault
by _txf_ on Sat 22nd Mar 2008 02:15 UTC in reply to "RE: Kubuntus fault"
_txf_
Member since:
2008-03-17

Unfortunately kubuntu is one of the few high quality deb based KDE distros around (I should give sidux a go tho). I kinda dislike rpms but I hate openSUSEs packaging system everytime I try it I have to add external repos just to get things like non crippled ktorrent.

Inevitably the sheer amount of external repos leads to loads of packaging conficts. The dialog box that pop's up is just plain hideous. Not to mention zypper and yast are damn slow.

With mandriva I couldn't find 64 bit downloads without getting the dvd image...sigh...

Other than that I would say that SUSE and Mandriva are more polished than Kubuntu, but the packaging issue is a deal breaker for me.

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[3]: Kubuntus fault
by sbergman27 on Sat 22nd Mar 2008 02:30 in reply to "RE[2]: Kubuntus fault"
sbergman27 Member since:
2005-07-24

FWIW, you actually have another *buntu option. Install regular Ubuntu. And then instead of installing Kubuntu-desktop, install kde-base instead. (Or is it KDE desktop? Well, it's some kde metapackage that isn't kubuntu-desktop.) I know that some people prefer that. Last I tested, there was a *dramatic* difference in memory consumption and performance on lower memory machines. And, like I say, some people simply prefer it to going the Kubuntu route. I'm writing this from my Fedora 8 Gnome desktop. But I don't blame you for wanting to stick with apt. Package management under Fedora is excellent. But it's really hard to beat the polish of apt.

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[3]: Kubuntus fault
by elsewhere on Sat 22nd Mar 2008 05:22 in reply to "RE[2]: Kubuntus fault"
elsewhere Member since:
2005-07-13

Inevitably the sheer amount of external repos leads to loads of packaging conficts. The dialog box that pop's up is just plain hideous. Not to mention zypper and yast are damn slow.


Sheer amount? There's one external repo now, since the previous two merged into one as of 10.3. Anything else you could want is likely available in the build-service, which compiles packages against the various core versions of openSUSE, and automatically recompiles when a dependent package changes, specifically to bypass potential dependency issues. It is, frankly, a superior way of managing packages that the other distros are only starting to implement themselves. The only way to run into dependency issues is by mixing repos from different versions of openSUSE (which, sadly, people do), and the same thing will happen on any distro, dep or rpm. If you do happen to run into a dependency issue, it's a bug with the packaging that should be reported to the developers, as with any distro, deb or rpm.

If you want to complain about the the performance of Yast/zypper, that's fair enough, since even the devs have acknowledged it and reworked the backend for 11.0 specifically for (significant) performance improvements, but is it possible to have a discussion about deb vs rpm without falling into the long-extinct "dependency hell" issues? If you run into dependency issues on a modern system, it's a packaging error, and it's not like Ubuntu hasn't had similar issues with their hastily repackaged Debian debs in the past.

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[4]: Kubuntus fault
by TheMonoTone on Sat 22nd Mar 2008 07:39 in reply to "RE[3]: Kubuntus fault"
TheMonoTone Member since:
2006-01-01

This just isn't true. In the combined ubuntu distros I actually have almost every library I need.

In the suse distros there's at least a half dozen missing. I'll even list them since you seem to be interested in fixing it.
bdb c++ bindings and headers for the version required by Ice
zeroc's Ice (all the bindings)
player/stage/gazebo
lame (yes that lame)

Actually, if opensuse had all those. I'd be using opensuse instead of shoddy kubuntu right now. Seriously. Ice has been sitting on the wanted list forever now though, and there's even a srpm available from them. Yet no one has bothered to modify it and fix it for opensuse. I would personally if I had the time and knowledge of rpm spec files (which seem pretty aweful).

Fix it please. And fix the crappy media playback situation as well. And the super long install times. And the zypper "I don't know what to do now" issues where it asks me, and I have no clue of course.

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[4]: Kubuntus fault
by _txf_ on Sat 22nd Mar 2008 14:51 in reply to "RE[3]: Kubuntus fault"
_txf_ Member since:
2008-03-17

I have never mixed different versions of repos. Nor would I call it dependency hell. Its just damn unfriendly, I can usually resolve these issued when that idiot box full of red and yellow highlights full of garbage text (incidentally zypper does the same but without the pretty colours) pops up telling me that there a conflict in packages that have been supplied by another repo. Its also fairly annoying that all the yast programs are separate.

Maybe I just like synaptic or adept and their speed too much. Searching for packages in adept is even faster than synaptic.

On the whole I would describe the apt system and the gui related tools in (k)ubuntu as being much more streamlined and more importantly easy for new users.

I will be watching for improvements in the future

Reply Parent Score: 1