Linked by Thom Holwerda on Sat 3rd May 2008 05:47 UTC, submitted by ZacharyM
Slackware, Slax One of the oldest Linux distributions, Slackware, has pushed out another release. "Well folks, it's that time to announce a new stable Slackware release again. So, without further ado, announcing Slackware version 12.1! Since we've moved to supporting the 2.6 kernel series exclusively (and fine-tuned the system to get the most out of it), we feel that Slackware 12.1 has many improvements over our last release (Slackware 12.0) and is a must-have upgrade for any Slackware user."
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RE[6]: Packages, packages...
by garymax on Mon 5th May 2008 21:34 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: Packages, packages..."
garymax
Member since:
2006-01-23

Your final comment, "But that's OK. Those who use Slackware are the only ones who need to know." reveals just how conceited the majority of Slackware users are.


No conceit, here. Just an appreciation for the distro and a statement of fact.

While I take umbrage to the statement "Slackware lacks a package manager" this lack of knowledge by those outside the Slackware community really doesn't affect Slackware users who know better. We just like to set the record straight every once in a while.

As for making things "easy", it's not about ease of use, per se. It's about efficiency and a clean system under the hood.

One reason why Pat Volkerding doesn't try to "make things easy" isn't because he has this thing against usability; he knows that the more layers of abstraction that are added to a system the more that system gets bloated and more prone to bugs and errors. Case in point: Ubuntu. It releases every six months--ready or not--and the community is left picking up the pieces, having to place bug reports at Launchpad. And the bugs that do get reported may not even be fixed until the next release because of their release/upgrade policy.

I'll take Slackware as it is. It's fast, efficient, reliable and secure. I'll take that over a bloated distro any day.

For what it's worth, I ran Kubuntu 7.10 and 8.04 along side of Slackware over the last several months leading up to the release of the latest versions of both distributions (Slackware and Kubuntu). I much prefer the stability of Slackware.

I took time to make the assessment rather than base it on community opinion.

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[7]: Packages, packages...
by OddFox on Mon 5th May 2008 22:32 in reply to "RE[6]: Packages, packages..."
OddFox Member since:
2005-10-05

You can't make an omelette without breaking a few eggs, and the pioneering distros who are on the forefront with technologies that actually improve the user experience are going to have more bugs than something like Slackware that as a rule doesn't touch upstream. I can appreciate that Slackware is a great distribution for specific purposes; however, it has far more potential and that potential has always been explored morseo by derivative systems such as Vector. Your case in point with bugs on Ubuntu paint a grim picture of users banging their heads against the wall due to show-stopping bugs. Personally, I haven't had any issues with the latest Ubuntu release, even during the alpha test stage. Were there bugs? Sure. My hardware/software configuration simply didn't bring them to my attention.

I suppose we'll have to agree to disagree on what makes a distribution good for end users. A fast, efficient, reliable and secure base system, which Slackware is, is all well and good, but it has the polish of a chunk of Pumice newly discovered from the ground. I also don't really notice anything of a speed hit going between Slackware, Ubuntu, Gentoo and Fedora. OpenSuSE I haven't gotten to test too much lately in terms of speed, but SuSE has traditionally been the more sluggish and polished distro. I haven't had any problems with performance on a Linux desktop since I first got 512MB of RAM and a 1GHz processor, that might sound like outlandish expectations for a desktop system that will be responsive and useful, but a system like that costs beans now and has for a long time.

I guess one of my biggest problems with Slackware is that it simply is so boring, it's what you would get if you went and did a LFS build and threw a tag onto what you have just created, and that's not a bad thing, it's just not something I look for in a distro for my desktop and the desktops of friends. Slackware has always just, to me, seemed like Debian without the philosophy and the package management with proper full dependency resolution support. Your arguments against layers of abstraction don't really stand up to intense scrutiny. How much are you willing to give up in your crusade against ewwwwbloated software that actually has features and advanced capabilities? Are you going to start advocating that everyone write in assembly code because it's so much less accident-prone?

I'll take Ubuntu/Fedora/Debian/Gentoo as it is. It's fast, efficient, reliable and secure. I'll take that over a hobbled distro any day.

Disclaimer: I have a machine that you'd be hard pressed to stress to the point of poor performance and responsiveness, but I haven't always and I regularly introduce newbies to Linux via Ubuntu (Gentoo if they really want it). Oh, and why oh why is Slackware still stuck using LILO by default?

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[8]: Packages, packages...
by garymax on Mon 5th May 2008 23:52 in reply to "RE[7]: Packages, packages..."
garymax Member since:
2006-01-23

How much are you willing to give up in your crusade against ewwwwbloated software that actually has features and advanced capabilities?


Just because I value reliability, speed, and a bloat-free system why does that mean I am on a crusade?

Go back and read my other posts. I used Kubuntu 7.10 and 8.04. I "converted" my father over to Linux with Kubuntu. He's happy with it. I don't "crusade" against him for using it. It's great that he's no longer using windows.

But seeing we'll have to agree to disagree don't make assumptions and throw prejoratives around without knowing the "who" behind the post. You read too much into my post, apparently.

And I never said that the *buntus were not usable. Remember, I used them myself for months. Though the bugs may not prevent one from using the system, they are there nonetheless.

Edited 2008-05-05 23:59 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[8]: Packages, packages...
by garymax on Tue 6th May 2008 00:46 in reply to "RE[7]: Packages, packages..."
garymax Member since:
2006-01-23

I guess one of my biggest problems with Slackware is that it simply is so boring, it's what you would get if you went and did a LFS build and threw a tag onto what you have just created, and that's not a bad thing, it's just not something I look for in a distro for my desktop and the desktops of friends.


And I think the above quote forms the basis of your statements that Slackware has all the charm of newly-mined pumice, that it is somehow "hobbled", and that you prefer other distros.

This is all fine. But to denigrate a distro without any data to back it up makes your remarks "fail under scrutiny."

Also, Slackware uses LILO because it works. Simple. Grub is also available for those wanting to use that boot manager.

Lastly, your remark about my advocating the use of assembly language is simply a reduction to absurdity. You take the sentiment too far.

But I think your quote above reveals your position. Which is a valid one. But, unfortunately, you seem to bring little data to the table to support your claims.

Edited 2008-05-06 00:50 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 1