Linked by Amjith Ramanujam on Fri 11th Jul 2008 22:30 UTC, submitted by fsmag
Linux "Recently a blog post entitled 'Why Desktop Linux is its own worst enemy' has come across my feed-radar a few times. It's yet another in the long line of 'Linux ain't ready yet' jeremiads and it doesn't really say anything new yet it got on my nerves. Why?" Ryan Cartwright at Freesoftware Magazine is on fine form with this wonderfully splenetic broadside. Read the full tirade at FSM.
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Who's really comparing ?
by galaxstar on Sat 12th Jul 2008 04:49 UTC
galaxstar
Member since:
2008-07-12

I tend to disagree with this article.

The author is complaining that Linux is being compared to Windows and OS X.
But isn't that what many Linux advocates have been doing for years ? I can't count how many times i've read Linux bloggers compare their OS to Vista or XP for instance.
Of course in the case of linux bloggers, Linux always gets the upper hand.

On another note 95% of the desktop market is a consumer market. That old chesnut about educating computer users, user participation etc is wrong. The majority of computer users want a computer product (incl the os). They don't want to be computer enthusiasts.

It is perfectly normal to compare available products from a user/consumer perspective even if the philosophy being Linux is radically different.
End users might care more about what they get (user experience) than about a very broad concept like free (as in speech) software.

Reply Score: 14

RE: Who's really comparing ?
by fuzzyping on Sat 12th Jul 2008 06:19 in reply to "Who's really comparing ?"
fuzzyping Member since:
2006-11-01

This is the typical "something for nothing" attitude that's so prevalent in the Linux community. You think that hobbyist developers owe you something, and that it's your responsibility to bitch about it when it doesn't meet your expectations.

This is exactly why I never try to sway users over from Linux to *BSD. Most Linux users are demanding and thankless. They think that if there's a feature missing somewhere, there must be a lonely programmer itching to solve it for them. They feel that "the Linux desktop" is close, but not quite there. If only those lazy [Gnome|KDE|Xfce] developers would get off their ass and give them more free code.

Me, me, me. Greedy users.

Reply Parent Score: 7

RE[2]: Who's really comparing ?
by gustl on Sat 12th Jul 2008 07:01 in reply to "RE: Who's really comparing ?"
gustl Member since:
2006-01-19

I wholehartedly agree.

I, for one, would like Windows and ESPECIALLY MS Office to be uncopyable.

I know, a real copy protection is not doable, but one can dream ...

Then Microsoft can cash in for every copy of MS Office, and lots of people will find out that other alternatives are much cheaper, but still up to the task.

Unfortunately MS Office is not like Windows, it does not REALLY need patches, at least not as badly as an operating system.

Reply Parent Score: 4

BSD bullshiting ...
by Moulinneuf on Sun 13th Jul 2008 20:08 in reply to "RE: Who's really comparing ?"
Moulinneuf Member since:
2005-07-06

Actually , it's your BSD lies and bullshit.

Let's look at the Linux kernel , it's highly funded and manned with many Free Software volunteer and Free Software funded pro developer. Let's look at all the BSD offers ... Nothing that remotely compare even do they are older.

Let's look at the X server , again the GNU/Linux user's distribution and company are the majority.

Let's look at the Desktop , Again Funded by GNU/Linux.

Let's look at individual software projects again GNU/linux.

Let's look at BSD device and hardware official support : NOTHING.

Most of the BSD user's work at GNU/Linux company because no one pay for BSD work and no one funds it.

The majority funder and donator on ALL BSD Projects are GNU/Linux company and user's.

When a community doesn't pay it don't get support :

AMD/ATI don't fully support BSD
Intel Don't fully support BSD
Apple don't support BSD at all.
Sun don't support BSD.
Microsoft don't acknowledge or support BSD.
Via ...
Dell ...
HP ...
Lenovo ...

It's clear that in reality it's the BSD who are typical "something for nothing" and mostly demanding and thankless.

You don't carry your weight in code , you don't carry your weight in developer , your documentation is an absolute joke or copy of GNU/Linux , you don't carry your weight in software , you don't carry your weight in funding , you don't carry your weight in support. ETC ...

Your code is not even certified legal.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE: Who's really comparing ?
by WorknMan on Sat 12th Jul 2008 16:43 in reply to "Who's really comparing ?"
WorknMan Member since:
2005-11-13

The author is complaining that Linux is being compared to Windows and OS X.
But isn't that what many Linux advocates have been doing for years ? I can't count how many times i've read Linux bloggers compare their OS to Vista or XP for instance.
Of course in the case of linux bloggers, Linux always gets the upper hand.


LOL, ain't that the truth? Linux pundits will compare it to Windows all day long, so long as it suits their agenda. They talk about how insecure/bloated Windows is, DRM hell, proprietary, etc.

But as soon as you flip the script and start talking about disadvantages of Linux as it compares to OSX and Windows, then suddenly it's an 'apples to oranges' kind of thing and they can't be compared.

Reply Parent Score: 7

RE[2]: Who's really comparing ?
by alexis on Sat 12th Jul 2008 18:21 in reply to "RE: Who's really comparing ?"
alexis Member since:
2007-05-21

WorknMan,

I think that they trying to say that GNU/Linux it's not comparable to Mac OS or Windows because GNU/Linux it's not about market share it's about users being free.

Of course advocates always makes GNU/Linux vs Mac OS vs Windows statements, articles and rants trying to show users the advantages besides of being free.

I could be totally wrong as there are many GNU/Linux advocates.

Reply Parent Score: 5

Moulinneuf Member since:
2005-07-06

"ain't that the truth? "


Simple answer is : NO.

Long answer : We are not the one comparing at all , or crying about the lack of certain company software on the OS , we are studying the competition or providing information to those who don't know what's available.

GNU/Linux user's welcome real disadvantage , it means there is a problem and it need fixing. The reality is GNU/Linux is superior to Windows and Mac OS X , but it lacks the same availability and service support the other two have.

Not that it's inferior , but there is no need for a corner GNU/Linux repair shop as the thing usually is not corrupted or broken down every day unlike the other OS. It either work or it doesn't. It's also legally and gratis from many source and vendor on the internet.

Why it can't be compared ? Because all GNU/Linux software run on Windows and Mac OS X and any other OS that take the time to compile them ( BSD , Solaris , Open Solaris , OS/2 , etc ... ).

- Mac OS X only run on Apple hardware.
- Almost all Apple software don't run on other OS

- Most Microsoft software don't run on other OS.
- Most Microsoft software don't run on Microsoft OS

Thr truth is this : GNU/Linux is better , you just refuse to accept reality. Your also not forced to discuss it or listen to it's user , you can't accept reality that your incompetent and un-qualified and unable to make it work without help from expert , your also not mature enough to set your god like ego aside and learn where you make mistake. Hence :

"GNU/linux is crap because I ( insert coward name of the day here ) can't make it work".

Unlike you I welcome honest comparison or when people show real problem that need fixing. This on any OS.

Reply Parent Score: 5

RE[2]: Who's really comparing ?
by marafaka on Mon 14th Jul 2008 09:45 in reply to "RE: Who's really comparing ?"
marafaka Member since:
2006-01-03

What people should be comparing here are preinstalled versus raw computers. I maintain many BSD and GNU desktops and servers and the users usually don't have the slightest clue what they're using. Nobody is complaining about "the desktop experience" or "the OS", but they probably would if they had to install anything by themselves. And the choice of the operating system doesn't have anything to do with that; it's about users and their culture.

Many people here have done a mistake by buying something that they can not manage. I suggest next time you plan to throw away some cash consult a real expert first, geeks ;)

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE: Who's really comparing ?
by Moulinneuf on Sun 13th Jul 2008 19:43 in reply to "Who's really comparing ?"
Moulinneuf Member since:
2005-07-06

Your the one complaining here , you can't make it work for you , so it become everyone else can't make it work.

Who's really comparing ? The Mac OS X and Windows
people in order to reassure them self of there choice , that they made the right expense and investment.

If you can't count that explain why you consider Mac OS X and Vista and XP superior. Your not honest anyway.

GNU/Linux as the upper hand in reality , we just reply to the same lies in order to debunk your usual lies and bullshit and point people who are interested in the available solution in the right direction.

What you compare is a Download you made and an installation you made vs an Industry OEM rescue DVD and or complete turn-key solution.

It's not GNU/Linux user's who have a problem with the lack of Adobe , Microsoft and Apple product on GNU/Linux. It's the Windows and Apple users.

GNU/Linux is an industry. We offer more desktop solution in more diverse offer in more country in more language , on more hardware and device.

Reply Parent Score: 6