Linked by Thom Holwerda on Tue 2nd Dec 2008 10:58 UTC
Two weeks ago, I published an article in which I explained what was wrong about Randall Kennedy's "Windows 7 Unmasked" article. This was noted by Infoworld's editor-in-chief Eric Knorr, who suggested that Randall and I enter into an email debate regarding the various points made in our articles. We agreed upon publishing this email thread as-is, unedited (I didn't even fix the spelling errors), on both Infoworld and OSNews. We agreed that Randall would start the debate, and that I had the final word. Read on for the entertaining email debate (I figured it would be best to give each email its own page, for clarity's sake. My apologies if this makes each individual page much shorter than what you're used to from OSNews).
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RE: Still Flogging Those Benchmarks?
by google_ninja on Tue 2nd Dec 2008 19:32
in reply to "Still Flogging Those Benchmarks?"
Member since:2006-02-05
RE: Still Flogging Those Benchmarks?
by segedunum on Wed 3rd Dec 2008 00:49
in reply to "Still Flogging Those Benchmarks?"
Member since:2005-07-06
his benchmark drives the UI at superhuman speeds and finds that it performs 40% slower. This has nothing to do with the Kernel as such and everything to do with the way GDI acceleration has changed (gone away!) in Vista.
That's the harsh truth I'm afraid. No one is going to look at their existing applications and say "Yay, we can run them 40% slower!" No one cares that Microsoft has borked GDI, although you might.
While GDI lives in the kernel address space (win32k.sys) it's hardly a kernel subsystem
Contradiction in terms. I'd call that a kernel subsystem if it's in there, but there seems to be a lot of delusion about what is or isn't in a kernel these days.
and MinWin can run without it.
Yay. Let's run no applications.
I guess businesses should stay with XP... if they employ amazing robots who can type, scroll, and insert charts simultaneously at a rate of several operations per second.
He, he, he. Yer. That's why they have computers and these things called 'applications' that can do nifty things like scripting to do all that for them at a faster rate every eighteen months or something. Or did I miss something?
Frankly, desktop applications (even "Enterprise" ones) do not stress the kernel's performance characteristics that much since the bottlenecks are usually elsewhere.
Bottom line: It's still slower, no matter where you believe the bottlenecks to be.
RE[2]: Still Flogging Those Benchmarks?
by PlatformAgnostic on Thu 4th Dec 2008 09:33
in reply to "RE: Still Flogging Those Benchmarks?"
Member since:2006-01-02
Let me get this straight: You script the UI of your applications to get work done quickly? Maybe that's good for a quick-n-dirty system (I've made a few of these with Excel and VBA), but most 'real' scripting environments don't really involve a whole lot of GDI drawing.
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Member since:
2006-01-02
I see Randall is still pushing those benchmark results he collected some time ago to get the 40% number.
If I understand things correctly (I haven't installed that stuff, but I've read a little about what's in it), his benchmark drives the UI at superhuman speeds and finds that it performs 40% slower. This has nothing to do with the Kernel as such and everything to do with the way GDI acceleration has changed (gone away!) in Vista. While GDI lives in the kernel address space (win32k.sys), it's hardly a kernel subsystem and MinWin can run without it.
I guess businesses should stay with XP... if they employ amazing robots who can type, scroll, and insert charts simultaneously at a rate of several operations per second. Frankly, desktop applications (even "Enterprise" ones) do not stress the kernel's performance characteristics that much since the bottlenecks are usually elsewhere. One exception is the apps that have huge datasets, like CAD/CAM. Win7's memory manager improvements are specifically targetted at these scenarios.