Linked by Rahul on Fri 6th Mar 2009 08:37 UTC
X11, Window Managers Plymouth is a freedesktop.org project to create a flicker free graphical bootup system designed and developed by Red Hat and included in Fedora 10. Red Hat has been working on Xorg drivers and within the Linux kernel to improve and enhance the kernel mode support needed for Plymouth. Fedora 10 included support for many ATI cards and this is being developed further in Fedora 11 to cover Intel and Nvidia cards as well. Plymouth supports a flexible and powerful plug-in system which can be used to create Plymouth themes. Fedora includes several of them including a simple progress bar and the solar plugin. Now additional work is being done to improve many things and this will land up in Fedora 11 as well.
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RE: Forgetting what's important
by VistaUser on Fri 6th Mar 2009 11:46 UTC in reply to "Forgetting what's important"
VistaUser
Member since:
2008-03-08

Instead of working on this kind of crap, why can't they focus on things that are more important from a usability point of view ?


They are.

Why can't it detect that screen's maximum resolution automatically ?


erm... Plymouth does exactly this. Maybe read up on something before making a clueless comment/rant?

I know some of these things might be related to drivers and closed source drivers might stop some of the attempts to do this, but there's no reason for why it can't work with some of the available drivers. It's silly (and I think it embarasses every desktop Linux user) to have to restart X because of an external screen.


XRANDR should help solve those issues. Already developed and working for many situations and drivers.

And I'm sure I could find many more examples of this kind of stuff. Many people spend time developing silly and useless plugins for Compiz Fusion when they could probably spend it solving stupid bugs that have persisted for years on desktop apps. Users who come from other platforms won't care about spinning cubes if they can't perform simple tasks they do every day or configure some things with no hassle.


Different problems unrelated to the graphics subsystem. Throwing more people at a problem does not mean it will be solved.

The reason people write plugins for Compiz fusion is because they enjoy it or the effects. I doubt any corporate backer is paying anyone for such frivolities, so telling people what to do here is like me telling you how to spend your free time. I doubt the developers would appreciate that much.

I'm an experienced user (and a previous Gentoo and Slackware user) who doesn't really care about manually editing a config file every once in a while, but sometimes I just want to get some work done and I don't want the system to get in my way.


And this may be at the heart of the problem - an experienced user with how things worked struggling with how they currently work and new technology changes.

Since the last year there has been tremendous amount of work done on the graphics subsystem and it is all coming together.

Edited 2009-03-06 11:46 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 6

trodrigues Member since:
2007-08-26

"Instead of working on this kind of crap, why can't they focus on things that are more important from a usability point of view ?


They are.
"

I know they are. I just wanted to reinforce my point of view.

Why can't it detect that screen's maximum resolution automatically ?


erm... Plymouth does exactly this. Maybe read up on something before making a clueless comment/rant?
[/q]

If Plymouth is an application that provides a splash screen on boot, explain to me how that will help me detect different resolutions if I connect my laptop to different external screens at different places. I've read up on Plymouth, and if it does more than what it says it does, then someone forgot to mention it.


XRANDR should help solve those issues. Already developed and working for many situations and drivers.

Right. And as soon as I activate Xinerama XRANDR goes away. Maybe it's an issue with ATI drivers by itself and it doesn't happen to everyone, but it's an issue.


Different problems unrelated to the graphics subsystem. Throwing more people at a problem does not mean it will be solved.

The reason people write plugins for Compiz fusion is because they enjoy it or the effects. I doubt any corporate backer is paying anyone for such frivolities, so telling people what to do here is like me telling you how to spend your free time. I doubt the developers would appreciate that much.


Ok, maybe I was a little harsh on this one, but I'm just saying that if I managed to come up with time to contribute to an OSS project, I'd probably try to use it to solve important problems. Sometimes people forget that F/OSS is all about people trying to solve each others problems.


And this may be at the heart of the problem - an experienced user with how things worked struggling with how they currently work and new technology changes.

I'm not struggling with "how things worked". I've started using Ubuntu a long time ago because I didn't wanted to get stuck in arcane distros like Slackware, so I've been trying to keep up with the evolution of things.


Since the last year there has been tremendous amount of work done on the graphics subsystem and it is all coming together.


I know it has, and not only by F/OSS developers but by driver developers as well. Up until a while ago, Xinerama on my ATI X2300 was nearly impossible.

Reply Parent Score: 0

Rahul Member since:
2005-07-06

Plymouth is described in detail in the first link. Before jumping to incorrect conclusions about what it is, read about it more. Plymouth uses kernel mode system aka KMS which is a step towards solving some of the resolution issues as well. Plymouth is not just for pretty graphics and it also helps log boot messages correctly.

If you want to know about KMS and why it is important, refer

http://keithp.com/blogs/kernel-mode-drivers/

Reply Parent Score: 2

siride Member since:
2006-01-02

Then don't use Xinerama. You should be using XRANDR anyways because it does all that Xinerama did and much better. If you have bugs, file them with the X.org folks or your distribution and help make it better.

On my machine, XRANDR works fine and detects resolution correctly. I have a slightly older ATI card, so it's probably better supported. In any case, it can be done. No restarting the X server, no hacking around with xorg.conf. It Just Works (tm).

Reply Parent Score: 2

vivainio Member since:
2008-12-26

Sometimes people forget that F/OSS is all about people trying to solve each others problems.


More often, it's about

- scratching your own itches.
- scratching the itches of people that pay your salary
- technical indulgence

Reply Parent Score: 1

Laurence Member since:
2007-03-26


I'm not struggling with "how things worked". I've started using Ubuntu a long time ago because I didn't wanted to get stuck in arcane distros like Slackware, so I've been trying to keep up with the evolution of things.


Well there is your problem.
I've found Ubuntu to be one of the worst dristo's for needless rebooting (though, even Ubuntu picks up the maximum screen resolution on my laptop)

My current preferred distro, Arch, picks up the dual head on my laptop and i can just plug / unplug additional monitors to my hearts content. Never had a problem with that until I switched to Ubuntu.

The problem with Ubuntu is, to make it more usable to the novice, they've sacrificed some of the shortcuts us experieced users would take in the more hands on distros.
So if your problem is having to constantly reboot to apply changes - then perhaps you shouldn't be using such a beginner level Linux.

Reply Parent Score: 2