Linked by Thom Holwerda on Tue 14th Jul 2009 15:30 UTC
Amiga & AROS So we finally meet! You can't imagine how hard I've tried to get my hands on a machine that could run AmigaOS 4 in all its glory. I've never used the Amiga before - not during its heydays, and not during its afterglow - so it meant an unexplored world for me. You can imagine my excitement when ACube Systems, makers of the sam440ep board that runs AmigaOS 4.1, offered a review machine to me, built around their own PowerPC sam440ep flex motherboard.
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Good, balanced, critical write-up
by lproven on Wed 15th Jul 2009 13:01 UTC
lproven
Member since:
2006-08-23

Like it.

One of the serious problems of a number of the old "legacy" OSs fighting for survival today - e.g. RISC OS, AmigaOS in its various forms, and arguably Solaris and the BSDs - is that they are far too keen to hang on to their old-fashioned ways from when the world was young and there were no "standard" ways of doing things.

I think one reason for the success of Linux is that it doesn't tend to do this. It emulates bits of the leading OSs. Unix used to have focus-follows-mouse, but the legions of Windows and Mac users aren't used to that, so Linux dropped it. Unix GUIs never had file and folder icons on the desktop, but that's what people are used to, so we got KDE and GNOME, which behaved the way newcomers expect. Same for cut&paste, permanent app menus (instead of on a desktop-middle-click) and so on.

Then you look at the Amiga variants, which default to behaviour unlike any other GUI from the last 25 years. I've not tried OS4, lacking suitable hardware, but I have an Amiga 1200 with OS 3.1 and I've tried AROS. It's very weird indeed if you're used to any other OS.

Compare with BSD and its insistence on its own system of "disk slices" and whatnot. Guys, you're on a platform with its own partitioning system.

For the Amiga types, for instance: guys, we all have near-terabyte super-fast hard disks now. We're not booting off floppies any more. You can drop the RAMdisk support, we no longer need it. Leave it as an installable option for the retro-heads who are stuck in the 1980s.

Adapt to change. Be like a reed not a tree; bend with the wind, rather than snap.

Reply Score: 4

madcrow Member since:
2006-03-13

I will admit that the Amiga way of doing things can be a bit odd (though it's not that hard to get used to, as it DOES have a high level of internal consistancy) but I feel that you're attack on the BSD partitioning system is off base: The PC partitioning system is extremenely inflexible and while things like GUID and EFI might someday fix the problem, at the moment the BSD solution of "create one 'system' partition and then divide that up in your own smarter way" makes perfect sense.

Reply Parent Score: 2

lproven Member since:
2006-08-23

It doesn't make sense, inasmuch as the PC has its own native partitioning system already. Trying to impose one's own rules when one is working in someone else's territory is not a winning tactic.

When Linux runs on SPARC hardware, it uses SPARC partitioning. When it runs on Macs, it uses Mac partitioning. When it runs on PCs, it uses PC partitioning.

Run Mac OS X on a PC, it uses PC partitioning.

Etc. etc.

This is, I'd argue, The Right Way. When in Rome, do as the Romans do. Adapt to the prevailing local customs and systems.

AmigaOS grew up in isolation; e.g., for many Amiga fans, Intuition was probably the first windowing system they ever used. Now, though, there are accepted ways of working, so AmigaOS /has/ to conform to the way everyone else works now.

It is a case of conform or die, I'm afraid.

I'm all for putting in support for working the old way for users who prefer it, but it needs to work the way non-Amigans expect out of the box. Firstly, there may be hundreds of thousands of old Amigans out there, but they are a small potential market. Secondly, even all those old fans have probably been using Windows, Macs or Linux since they moved on from their Miggys.

It's a theoretical point, really - AOS4/4.1 manifestly hasn't done this, and the BSDs are unlikely to change their ways now. If either it, it would infuriate loyal fans. I'm just trying to point out a philosophical difference in outlook, that's all!

Reply Parent Score: 1

kolla Member since:
2009-07-15


For the Amiga types, for instance: guys, we all have near-terabyte super-fast hard disks now. We're not booting off floppies any more. You can drop the RAMdisk support, we no longer need it. Leave it as an installable option for the retro-heads who are stuck in the 1980s.

Adapt to change. Be like a reed not a tree; bend with the wind, rather than snap.


Listen, schmuck - if you change AmigaOS to behave like the rest of the crap, then there's really no point in using AmigaOS, is there? Besides, who are you tell us how AmigaOS should be? You're not an amiga user, so your oppinions regarding how AmigaOS should work are moot.

And I'm not stuck in the eighties, I'm just fed up with the current situation where all systems are focused on the needs of the so called "most users", and how to attract windows users to their plattform, for reasons I really dont understand. I much rather have a system that I know and like, used by less than thousand people on the planet, than dozens of systems all badly mimicking windows.

And writing off RAM disks in these days of SSD netbooks, where linux installs put more and more on tmpfs. No, we're not booting off floppies anymore, we're booting off memory cards.

Reply Parent Score: 3

dragossh Member since:
2008-12-16

Listen, schmuck - if you change AmigaOS to behave like the rest of the crap, then there's really no point in using AmigaOS, is there? Besides, who are you tell us how AmigaOS should be? You're not an amiga user, so your oppinions regarding how AmigaOS should work are moot.


That’s the kind of elitist attitude that, coupled with the high price of Amiga hardware, makes people not consider Amiga. And besides, maybe he used AROS.

I much rather have a system that I know and like, used by less than thousand people on the planet, than dozens of systems all badly mimicking windows.


That’s right. I hate that there is no diversity in the UI. Everyone except Amiga, Apple, RISC OS and Haiku copies Windows instead of trying to come up with better ways of doing things. But that doesn’t mean AmigaOS should cling to the past and not try to expand its userbase just to be different.

And writing off RAM disks in these days of SSD netbooks, where linux installs put more and more on tmpfs. No, we're not booting off floppies anymore, we're booting off memory cards.


I bet he didn’t realise the usefulness of the RAM Disk when you download something and want to try it out.

Edited 2009-07-15 17:50 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 2

Soulbender Member since:
2005-08-18

Guys, you're on a platform with its own partitioning system.


Too bad the X86 partitioning system is braindead. Give me slices any day over 4 "primary" partitions and the horrible "extended" partitions nightmare.
Slices kick ass, X86 partitioning not so much.

Reply Parent Score: 3