Linked by Thom Holwerda on Mon 27th Jul 2009 20:10 UTC
KDE For a very long time now, I've been on the hunt for a distribution that really put a lot of effort into their KDE4 implementation. This has been a frustrating search, full of broken installations, incredibly slow performance, and so many visual artifacts they made my eyes explode. Since KDE 4.3 is nearing release, I had to pick up this quest in order to take a look at where 4.3 stands - and I found a home in the KDE version of Fedora 11. Read on for a look as to where KDE 4.3 currently stands.
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terog
Member since:
2007-03-09


I don't think it's KDE's fault at all because the average distributor seems to be so, so poor at making decisions as to what goes in. PulseAudio is the biggest example of an exceptionally poor decision made by many distributors to include it.


I should have said "partly KDE's fault", as I was only talking about the default settings in the DE. This is related to the problem that many people have complained over the years: you often have to tweak KDE yourself in order to get good usability. In contrast to this, Gnome is very often considered to have good defaults and usability.

Let's take this as an example from the article where Thom talks about the problem with the new "drilling" feature:

"It does have an implementation problem, though; as the drilling happens on delayed mouse-over, it often happens by accident when moving your mouse around or when trying to actually open a folder in Dolphin."

I can't believe they're even considering to make it work by mouse-over. I'm sure though, that they'll provide a setting to change it to on-click behavior. This will still mean that the bad default behavior will make it to most of the distributions.

Reply Parent Score: 3

Thom_Holwerda Member since:
2005-06-29

I can't believe they're even considering to make it work by mouse-over. I'm sure though, that they'll provide a setting to change it to on-click behavior. This will still mean that the bad default behavior will make it to most of the distributions.


That's the problem. They CANNOT make it work on click, because the default single-click behaviour is to open Dolphin. Even fi they changed opening Dolphin to double click, you'd still have a problem because on the first click of a double click you'd get drilling.

It's an interesting and useful feature, but it conflicts with the usual behaviour of a folder view. Maybe they should use middle click or something, I don't know. This nut is tougher to crack than you'd think.

Reply Parent Score: 3

setec_astronomy Member since:
2007-11-17

It's an interesting and useful feature, but it conflicts with the usual behaviour of a folder view. Maybe they should use middle click or something, I don't know. This nut is tougher to crack than you'd think.


How about using active corners + single click (a la Dolphin) or mini-hover icons (similar to what is used in Lancelot) for drilling?

Personally, I would advise against defaulting to input actions that don't translate well to all target devices (think touchscreens).

Reply Parent Score: 2

terog Member since:
2007-03-09

That's the problem. They CANNOT make it work on click, because the default single-click behaviour is to open Dolphin. Even fi they changed opening Dolphin to double click, you'd still have a problem because on the first click of a double click you'd get drilling.


I see. Didn't think it trough... However, it still works as a general example to make my point more clear.

Reply Parent Score: 2

segedunum Member since:
2005-07-06

In contrast to this, Gnome is very often considered to have good defaults and usability.

Yes, because more often than not it doesn't do anything. It's easy to decide on defaults when all you have are a handful of widgets on a window and you have far fewer features and you've decided that you don't want to face and solve the usability problems as a result. That's how Gnome, collectively, has decided to progress. Gnome is nowhere near having the 'drilling' problem below because it isn't close to being able to implement anything like it.

I can't believe they're even considering to make it work by mouse-over. I'm sure though, that they'll provide a setting to change it to on-click behavior.

I'm not sure that they can change it to a clickable behaviour. As I understand it it is supposed to be a bit of a cross between a preview and actually physically opening a Dolphin window. I haven't tried it yet though so I stand corrected.

As Thom says though, trying to get the implementation of a neat feature like this as usable as possible is a very difficult thing to get right.

Reply Parent Score: 6

terog Member since:
2007-03-09

Yes, because more often than not it doesn't do anything. It's easy to decide on defaults when all you have are a handful of widgets on a window and you have far fewer features and you've decided that you don't want to face and solve the usability problems as a result.


True, but KDE has had "strange" defaults even in simple things like e.g. opening a document - not in a separate app as usual but embedded in the Konqueror window. Sure it is a powerful feature for those who desire it, but for a newbie coming from other environments it can very confusing and therefore should not be the default action, IMHO.

But I do think that with KDE4 they are improving the defaults though.

As Thom says though, trying to get the implementation of a neat feature like this as usable as possible is a very difficult thing to get right.


Agreed.

Reply Parent Score: 2

Bille Member since:
2007-05-31

Somehow I misread part of your comment as "declined to progress" ;) .

Reply Parent Score: 2