Linked by Thom Holwerda on Fri 31st Jul 2009 12:13 UTC
Microsoft With Apple doing really, really well, and with Microsoft having its first sets of negative figures since the company's founding, Microsoft CEO points his arrows towards Cupertino. In a talk to members of the press and analyst community, Ballmer talked about Microsoft vs. Apple.
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Get some self-respect
by Jack Matier on Fri 31st Jul 2009 14:00 UTC
Jack Matier
Member since:
2005-07-17

Just as I was thinking getting in on the "let's be negative towards apple" bandwagon, this article really put things in perspective for me and got me writing a Pro's and Cons list that comes from recent conversations with co-workers and friends who either run PC's or Mac's or both. Please note that there's a lot of generalities and perceptions in what lays ahead.

PC Pro's:
- You can get a whole setup for much cheaper.
- Certain pieces of software do a better job at things.
- You can get better hardware.
- Games, while some will work on Mac, you're going to need a PC if you're serious about it.

PC Con's:
- It comes riddled with trials and stuff from your OEM
- It's not reliable enough.
- If your/a child gets on it things tend to go downhill from there. Costing you more time or money down the road.


Mac Pro's:
- It actually comes with the full fledged operating system disk.
- You know, disks not riddled with crap you need to remove that's put in there by OEM's.
- The software that you can get for the Mac, while costing more than the windows counterpart, tends to be more effective at doing its job.
- The hardware is pretty stable.
- Application handling actually makes sense.
- It's cool for me and mom.

Mac Con's:
- It's expensive. Really expensive.
- The hardware is often very limiting for the price, for $3000 how does one not end up getting a blu-ray burner and coffee maker installed?
- Printer support seems to be about on par with Linux.

I know that if I want to get things done in a business setting, the mac is going to allow me to do it and the price is a moot point, even in these economic times when compared to the cost of an employee.

On the other hand if I want something to play on it's going to be a PC, despite it's coming with crap and self-respect issues. Isn't self value and respect an important tool for selling one's self? Is that not what a product is trying to do?

Computers that have Windows need to brush their teeth from OEM's and be proud of themselves. Put out a guide of great software rather than allowing frustrating trials and (in general), crap. Clean up the product line, don't be afraid to give something that's not crippleware to try and squeeze more bucks. It wouldn't cost much more for the sort of polish I'm talking about. Something to make it not seem like a sellout. I'm sure perspective would change then. But maybe not.

(Update) Note: I'm basing a lot of this from what I see of Windows 7, which is looking pretty solid in its RC stages.

Edited 2009-07-31 14:11 UTC

Reply Score: 1

RE: Get some self-respect
by boldingd on Fri 31st Jul 2009 15:19 in reply to "Get some self-respect"
boldingd Member since:
2009-02-19

I know that if I want to get things done in a business setting, the mac is going to allow me to do it and the price is a moot point, even in these economic times when compared to the cost of an employee.


I don't know what business you're in, so for you it could easily be different, but for me, GNU/Linux systems are far and away the most productivity-accomodating OS's available. There are just so many "power tools" immediately available in a GNU/Linux environment (sed, grep, robust shell scripts, Unix pipelines, Perl, gcc, Vim -- oh, how I adore Vim). Granted, they're not as friendly, but I'll trade a little friendliness for a lot of power any day. And yes, I know that Cygwin exists, and a lot of those tools have Windows builds/ports/equivalents: it's kindof an "it just works" thing: "apt-get gcc g++ gnat vim gtk-dev" and you're good to go.

On the other hand if I want something to play on it's going to be a PC, despite it's coming with crap and self-respect issues.


Agreed completely. Steam games are the main reason I have a Vista install.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[2]: Get some self-respect
by dagw on Fri 31st Jul 2009 16:49 in reply to "RE: Get some self-respect"
dagw Member since:
2005-07-06

it's kindof an "it just works" thing: "apt-get gcc g++ gnat vim gtk-dev" and you're good to go.

Unless you're one of the few people in the world who's job doesn't involve developing gtk apps for Unix ;)

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[2]: Get some self-respect
by Jack Matier on Fri 31st Jul 2009 22:48 in reply to "RE: Get some self-respect"
Jack Matier Member since:
2005-07-17

It used to be the case for me as well until I started doing designing, accounting and project management alongside development.

Things tend to work that much more reliably when run in it's native environment and intensive applications happen to be more snappy in a non-virtualized environment.

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE: Get some self-respect
by Mellin on Fri 31st Jul 2009 22:52 in reply to "Get some self-respect"
Mellin Member since:
2005-07-06

"- Printer support seems to be about on par with Linux."

i've never had problems finding printer drivers

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[2]: Get some self-respect
by darknexus on Sat 1st Aug 2009 00:05 in reply to "RE: Get some self-respect"
darknexus Member since:
2008-07-15

"- Printer support seems to be about on par with Linux."

i've never had problems finding printer drivers


Actually, Linux and OS X are almost equal in out of the box printer support, for the simple reason that OS X utilizes cups as well as having gutenprint preinstalled just like Linux does. The differences come into play when manufacturer-supported drivers are shipped with OS X as well, as is the case with HP and Epson devices for example. In Epson's case, these drivers are quite good, in HP's case it's not always such an improvement especially if your device is a few years old. Fortunately it's easy enough to use the gutenprint drivers if need be, and if you do need to download a driver, most OS X printer drivers seem to be free of the crapware that plagues the majority of Windows drivers (HP, I'm looking at you).
I actually don't find device support to be much of an issue in OS X, many are supported right away and those that aren't usually have decent quality drivers. These days it's pretty easy to find Mac-compatible devices.

Reply Parent Score: 2