Linked by Thom Holwerda on Tue 17th Nov 2009 16:22 UTC, submitted by diegocg
Fedora Core Fedora 12 has been released today. "I'm proud to announce the release of Fedora 12, the latest innovative Linux distribution from the Fedora Project, a global, collaborative partnership of free software community members sponsored by Red Hat."
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As a Fedora 11 user
by charlieg on Tue 17th Nov 2009 16:55 UTC
charlieg
Member since:
2005-07-25

...and a fairly content one at that, there doesn't seem to be any compelling reason to upgrade.

That's the first time I've felt this way since I started dabbling in Linux 6 years ago. I'm actually content. That's been a long time coming but, from my own personal perspective, is a good sign that the Linux desktop has come of age.

I think I'll just hang back and enjoy the view from here!

(I was never close to being content with Windows although I stopped using it years ago)

Reply Score: 3

RE: As a Fedora 11 user
by sukru on Tue 17th Nov 2009 17:54 in reply to "As a Fedora 11 user"
sukru Member since:
2006-11-19

Fedora does have a short support cycle for older distributions (two releases + 1 month?). Thus you'll need to upgrade pretty soon.

Unfortunately that's the status of Linux desktop right now. However if you're a little bit adventurous there is much to gain.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[2]: As a Fedora 11 user
by sbergman27 on Tue 17th Nov 2009 18:02 in reply to "RE: As a Fedora 11 user"
sbergman27 Member since:
2005-07-24

Fedora does have a short support cycle for older distributions (two releases + 1 month?). Thus you'll need to upgrade pretty soon. Unfortunately that's the status of Linux desktop right now. However if you're a little bit adventurous there is much to gain.

I call foul on that. The Fedora-style forced upgrade treadmill is certainly *not* the status of the Linux desktop today. It is the status of Fedora. Period.

Other distros typically provide for at least 18 months of support, as opposed to Fedora's 13 months. And a number of solid and respected Linux distros give you anywhere from 3 years to 7+ years of support.

I don't believe that any Linux distro provides for a shorter maximum life-cycle than does Fedora.

And as an administrator of Linux business desktops, I am actually finding less and less advantage in upgrading to the latest. The Linux desktop is already pretty much there for me and my users. The main problem today being third party issues like IE only web apps.

Edited 2009-11-17 18:05 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 9

RE[2]: As a Fedora 11 user
by charlieg on Tue 17th Nov 2009 22:21 in reply to "RE: As a Fedora 11 user"
charlieg Member since:
2005-07-25

I don't feel under sufficient threat to be forced to upgrade even if the updates stop. Then I'll just have (what I consider) a stable OS.

Saying that I bet I install something newer just out of interest before the end of 2010 anyway.

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE: As a Fedora 11 user
by computeruser on Tue 17th Nov 2009 18:22 in reply to "As a Fedora 11 user"
computeruser Member since:
2009-07-21

The problem with using Fedora, non-LTS Ubuntu, and maybe OpenSUSE is that there is always a compelling reason to upgrade: continued support. You've got maybe seven months to go on Fedora 11.

A Fedora version is unsupported approximately 13 months after release. After that, no more updates. How well are Fedora/non-LTS Ubuntu releases supported in the period between the new version being released and the end of support? Do they get anything besides security/major bug fixes? Do they get kernel upgrades / backports? How well do upgrades work when skipping between versions?

Since Linux drivers are often only provided for the latest or recent mainline kernel version(s), one may have to upgrade, rebuild parts of the system, or backport drivers if they change hardware / need improved drivers. And after a few years, new software might not work with old dependencies. (For example, Firefox 3 won't build out-of-the-box using the libraries included with RHEL 4.)

I personally use CentOS to avoid these problems - Red Hat provide updates for years, and backports drivers and fixes.

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[2]: As a Fedora 11 user
by Lennie on Tue 17th Nov 2009 19:05 in reply to "RE: As a Fedora 11 user"
Lennie Member since:
2007-09-22

I doubt RedHat supports CentOS unless you pay them too.

My guess is they usually only support RHEL.

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[2]: As a Fedora 11 user
by sbergman27 on Tue 17th Nov 2009 19:27 in reply to "RE: As a Fedora 11 user"
sbergman27 Member since:
2005-07-24

How well are Fedora/non-LTS Ubuntu releases supported in the period between the new version being released and the end of support? Do they get anything besides security/major bug fixes? Do they get kernel upgrades / backports? How well do upgrades work when skipping between versions?

Firstly, as someone who has administered business desktops using both Fedora and non-LTS Ubuntu, I would not lump them into the same category. Both do get security and bug fixes. Fedora takes a rather cavalier attitude regarding kernel upgrades. Over the (short) lifetime of a Fedora release, one might see 3 major kernel upgrades. For example, Fedora 8 was released with 2.6.23. 2.6.24, 2.6.25, and 2.6.26 crashed our XDMCP server about once a week, bringing down about 70 users. (Yes, I gave each version a try. All Fedora kernels killed it right up to the point at which we switched to another distro.)

Ubuntu (non-LTS) takes a more conservative approach. If the distro releases with, say, 2.6.31, then 2.6.31 is what it will be for the 18 months that the version is supported. As an admin I find this to be a blessing. I'm uncertain whether drivers are added over the life of the kernel. I suspect they are. But I don't care that much about that in this use case.

The Fedora update pipeline is a firehose. Ubuntu's updates are much more controlled. I get the impression that you might feel that continued, aggressive updates are always a good thing. The admin in me shudders at that thought. But it also shudders a bit at the idea of being stuck with old tools for extended periods, which is why I use CentOS judiciously, and not for everything.

Reply Parent Score: 4

RE: As a Fedora 11 user
by rockwell on Wed 18th Nov 2009 20:29 in reply to "As a Fedora 11 user"
rockwell Member since:
2005-09-13

No reason to upgrade? Why miss the fun of borking your wireless and destroying your xorg.conf settings? Even better Flash will work *worse* once you upgrade.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[2]: As a Fedora 11 user
by sbergman27 on Thu 19th Nov 2009 03:00 in reply to "RE: As a Fedora 11 user"
sbergman27 Member since:
2005-07-24

Even better Flash will work *worse* once you upgrade.

Which only goes to show that every cloud has a silver lining. Would it be too much to hope that in the next release it won't work at all? Yes, I suppose it would be...

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE: As a Fedora 11 user
by debian_avenger on Thu 19th Nov 2009 02:51 in reply to "As a Fedora 11 user"
debian_avenger Member since:
2009-08-27

"That's the first time I've felt this way since I started dabbling in Linux 6 years ago. I'm actually content. That's been a long time coming but, from my own personal perspective, is a good sign that the Linux desktop has come of age."

You took the words right out of my mouth!

Reply Parent Score: 1