Linked by Thom Holwerda on Sun 14th Feb 2010 22:17 UTC
Internet & Networking There's a bit of ruckus going on at the moment in the world of HTML5. A number of people are claiming that Adobe has blocked the latest publication of the HTML5 standard. However, after diving into the actual mailing list threads, it becomes obvious quite quickly that it's nothing but a misunderstanding. Update: Masinter replies: "No part of HTML5 is, or was ever, 'blocked' in the W3C HTML Working Group - not HTML5, not Canvas 2D Graphics, not Microdata, not Video - not by me, not by Adobe."
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RE[4]: Comment by mtzmtulivu
by StephenBeDoper on Mon 15th Feb 2010 16:48 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Comment by mtzmtulivu"
StephenBeDoper
Member since:
2005-07-06

What about people still using P4's and 1GB RAM? (In fact, I know some people who run even lower spec systems)


As long as they're not trying to play HD content in fullscreen, they shouldn't have a problem. I've viewed youtube-size video on machines as slow as G4 800 and a P3-M 1.3Ghz.

So why should we be excluding rich internet content from people who don't want to spend hundreds on their computer every 2 years. It's not as if the same content can't be rendered on systems via other media formats.


In principle, I agree with you. But that's a problem that existed well before Flash gained widespread use for web video - and even if Flash were completely vanquished today, the problem would still exist.

Of course they will. But Flash Ads are what people notice for the now - thus it's what they complain about thus my point about why they dislike Flash.

Switch off nerd mode for one moment and think about what I wrote.
It wasn't a technical manual for Flash - it was a list of reasons why Flash was unpopular.


There's a fundamental flaw in that argument. People who would dislike a technology for such an irrational reason probably lack the technical literacy to actually recognize/identify when said technology is being used.

In other words, anyone clueless enough to reach that conclusion ("Flash unilaterally sucks because it's been used for annoying ads") is probably, at the same time, too clueless to even reach that conclusion in the first place. For that matter, they're probably more likely to blame the problems on their OS, browser, the brand of computer they use, or the alignment of Mercury and Jupiter.

I can see you love the technology


Can you point to a single example of wargum actually expressing that sentiment? Believe it or not, there are actually people who hold positions on Flash other than staunch advocacy or shrill anti-fanboyism.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[5]: Comment by mtzmtulivu
by smitty on Mon 15th Feb 2010 19:16 in reply to "RE[4]: Comment by mtzmtulivu"
smitty Member since:
2005-10-13

As long as they're not trying to play HD content in fullscreen, they shouldn't have a problem. I've viewed youtube-size video on machines as slow as G4 800 and a P3-M 1.3Ghz.


I've got a Q6600 (quad core core2duo @2.4GHz) and I'm forced to run Adblock if I don't want my browser to crawl to a halt. Why? Because I surf heavily and typically have 50+ tabs open at once. Try running any browser with hundreds of flash plugins open playing ads, and then tell me how fast your computer is.

Now, I don't actually know how much of a slowdown those ads would cause if they were using HTML5 instead of flash, but I'm pretty sure it would at least be quite a bit better, even if it did still cause a slowdown.

Reply Parent Score: 2

Bending Unit Member since:
2005-07-06

Dude, you are talking about between 50 and x-hundred tabs active at once.

That is not a relevant benchmark.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[6]: Comment by mtzmtulivu
by wargum on Mon 15th Feb 2010 21:30 in reply to "RE[5]: Comment by mtzmtulivu"
wargum Member since:
2006-12-15

I've got a Q6600 (quad core core2duo @2.4GHz) and I'm forced to run Adblock if I don't want my browser to crawl to a halt. Why? Because I surf heavily and typically have 50+ tabs open at once. Try running any browser with hundreds of flash plugins open playing ads, and then tell me how fast your computer is.

The question is: Does your scenario really show how crappy the Flash Player is? To me, this just sounds like a lot of work for a computer, even these days. Something one must understand is that the Flash Player has to compute even invisible things, or at least I assume that. Why? Since the Flash Player can't guess if an invisible tab contains Flash content that is only relevant when the tab is visible. This is a make-or-break scenario. So when having 50+ tabs open you might well have 100 or more Flash elements open at the same time, all needing to be computed. That's a lot! :-)

Now, I don't actually know how much of a slowdown those ads would cause if they were using HTML5 instead of flash, but I'm pretty sure it would at least be quite a bit better, even if it did still cause a slowdown.

Only time will tell, but I have doubts that it will be so much better.

Edited 2010-02-15 21:32 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 1

StephenBeDoper Member since:
2005-07-06

I've got a Q6600 (quad core core2duo @2.4GHz) and I'm forced to run Adblock if I don't want my browser to crawl to a halt. Why? Because I surf heavily and typically have 50+ tabs open at once. Try running any browser with hundreds of flash plugins open playing ads, and then tell me how fast your computer is.


You'll hear no argument from me there - FWIW, the only two Firefox extensions I use are Session Manager and FlashBlock. But what we were talking about was video playback/decoding via Flash.

Now, I don't actually know how much of a slowdown those ads would cause if they were using HTML5 instead of flash, but I'm pretty sure it would at least be quite a bit better, even if it did still cause a slowdown.


Possibly - although if there were a shift away from Flash for "rich media" ads, it would probably be towards things like Javascript, Silverlight, or (deity help us) Java applets. Rather than HTML5, that is.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[6]: Comment by mtzmtulivu
by Soulbender on Tue 16th Feb 2010 13:34 in reply to "RE[5]: Comment by mtzmtulivu"
Soulbender Member since:
2005-08-18

I've got a Q6600 (quad core core2duo @2.4GHz) and I'm forced to run Adblock if I don't want my browser to crawl to a halt. Why? Because I surf heavily and typically have 50+ tabs open at once. Try running any browser with hundreds of flash plugins open playing ads, and then tell me how fast your computer is.


Stay way from the porn sites, dude.

Reply Parent Score: 2