Linked by Kroc Camen on Thu 29th Apr 2010 23:04 UTC
Internet Explorer I am almost flabbergasted by the spin and blunt-face upon which this news is delivered. We were just discussing the pot calling the kettle black with Apple / Adobe and now Microsoft have also come out in favour of a closed video format for an open web--IE9's HTML5 video support will allow H264 only. Update Now that the initial shock is over, I've rewritten the article to actually represent news rather than something on Twitter.
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RE[2]: Uhm
by Thom_Holwerda on Thu 29th Apr 2010 23:33 UTC in reply to "RE: Uhm"
Thom_Holwerda
Member since:
2005-06-29

Rage-inducing. That was me randomly banging my fists on my aluminium Apple (why hello mr Hypocrisy, you are popular today) keyboard. This news pisses me off.

That means I still won't be able to experience the full web on my Haiku R1 install once it's here.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[3]: Uhm
by modmans2ndcoming on Thu 29th Apr 2010 23:34 in reply to "RE[2]: Uhm"
modmans2ndcoming Member since:
2005-11-09

How? Because the WC3 is going to standardize on h264?

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[4]: Uhm
by phoenix on Thu 29th Apr 2010 23:38 in reply to "RE[3]: Uhm"
phoenix Member since:
2005-07-11

With IE and Safari supporting only H.264 video, which covers the default browser of the two main OSes, why would anyone provide their content in non-H.264 content?

And if no-one provides their content in non-H.264 versions, how are non-IE/non-Safari users supposed to access it?

Reply Parent Score: 5

RE[3]: Uhm
by kragil on Thu 29th Apr 2010 23:41 in reply to "RE[2]: Uhm"
kragil Member since:
2006-01-04

I am really not shocked. OK, you would assume they would just use their media framework and hence supporting Theora is as "easy" as installing a plugin.

But the problem with that is that you have to secure all codecs you support and that can be really hard (media players that play a lot of content get security updates all the time)

That is just a excuse of course.
So what I am saying is that if you expect Apple and MS to do really selfish evil moves they will deliver.

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[4]: Uhm
by daveak on Fri 30th Apr 2010 18:35 in reply to "RE[3]: Uhm"
daveak Member since:
2008-12-29

Security problems are a prime example of why you should use system codecs. They are widely used by lots of systems, get lots of testing, and any holes are plugged by one update.

If you don't you end up with lots of differing, and possibly the same security holes depending on the source of the codec that get updated at different times leaving various apps vulnerable and others not.

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[3]: Uhm
by umccullough on Fri 30th Apr 2010 00:03 in reply to "RE[2]: Uhm"
umccullough Member since:
2006-01-26

That means I still won't be able to experience the full web on my Haiku R1 install once it's here.


I would guess that you will be able to, but perhaps not without infringing the H.264 patents ;)

Haiku does include ffmpeg for its video codecs, which includes libavcodec, which includes an h264 decoder last I checked.

So, you may eventually experience the "full web" on Haiku, but not without potentially breaking the law.

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[4]: Uhm
by aliquis on Fri 30th Apr 2010 18:59 in reply to "RE[3]: Uhm"
aliquis Member since:
2005-07-23
v RE[3]: Uhm
by tyrione on Fri 30th Apr 2010 02:01 in reply to "RE[2]: Uhm"
RE[4]: Uhm
by Tuishimi on Fri 30th Apr 2010 07:56 in reply to "RE[3]: Uhm"
Tuishimi Member since:
2005-07-06

I think he meant that as an example - it could have been other operating systems as well. I think the point is a double-team effort of MS and Apple to maintain control over who uses what codecs to record/playback their video on the internet. Google too, I think, no? Somehow this gets back to organizations looking to maintain control over their products (music, movies, etc.)

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[4]: Uhm
by segedunum on Fri 30th Apr 2010 11:43 in reply to "RE[3]: Uhm"
segedunum Member since:
2005-07-06

So the selfish angle arises.

No. The web was born and is what it is today out of the concept that every single OS and device (which these days is more and more important) could access it unfettered.

Reply Parent Score: 4

RE[4]: Uhm
by r_a_trip on Fri 30th Apr 2010 12:07 in reply to "RE[3]: Uhm"
r_a_trip Member since:
2005-07-06

So the selfish angle arises.

As if this angle wasn't prevalent in the pro H.264 camp...

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[3]: Uhm
by jokkel on Fri 30th Apr 2010 07:48 in reply to "RE[2]: Uhm"
jokkel Member since:
2008-07-07

The Haiku media kit supports h.264 playback today. It's based on ffmpeg after all.
Then the Webpositive browser just has to support the video tag with media kit and we can merrily play all the h.264 and theora video. I'll take that over Gnash any day thank you very much.

So even if Haiku would be obligated to exclude h.264 and other codecs for legal reasons. It could just as easily be added after installation. It's like on Linux. The first package I install on Ubuntu is ubuntu-restricted-extras to get all the codecs Canonical won't ship.
So in practice this will be no problem for the consumer.

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[4]: Uhm
by umccullough on Fri 30th Apr 2010 16:35 in reply to "RE[3]: Uhm"
umccullough Member since:
2006-01-26

The Haiku media kit supports h.264 playback today. It's based on ffmpeg after all.


Just a minor nit here - Haiku's media kit is *not* based on ffmpeg - but it does have an ffmpeg-based media addon which can support any codec supported by ffmpeg if there aren't any other suitable addons available for a given codec.

Thus, ffmpeg is basically used as a "backup" addon module in this capacity.

Reply Parent Score: 2