Linked by Eugenia Loli on Thu 6th May 2010 21:05 UTC
Ubuntu, Kubuntu, Xubuntu The recently released 10.04 version of Ubuntu is the third Long Term Support (LTS) version Canonical has released. I installed this new version on four of my laptops (2 netbooks, 1 normal laptop, 1 portable desktop replacement), and here's my impression of it.
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RE[7]: lethal upgrade
by lemur2 on Fri 7th May 2010 14:20 UTC in reply to "RE[6]: lethal upgrade"
lemur2
Member since:
2007-02-17

"
Either way of keeping a distribution upgraded ... a rolling distribution such as Arch, or a 6-monthly re-install (upgrade) of the OS partition (with user files intact), is far faster and easier than Windows


Arch is described in its faq as a do-it-yourself system. That's not even on the map of usability for typical users.
"

True. Arch is for people who know what they are doing. If people know what they are doing, they won't be running Windows.

Suggesting that a 6 month re-install of Ubuntu would be easier for users than upgrading Windows is absurd.


How so? To upgrade/re-install Kubuntu, which I have just finished doing for my wife's netbook, is a matter of booting the liveCD (or in this case, LiveUSB), clicking on the "install Kubuntu" icon once it has booted (if the liveCD or liveUSB boots OK then it obviously works on this machine), and then answering a few questions about your name, location, and what you want to call this computer. There is one tricky bit where you have to select "manually configure partitions" but all that you do is select the same partitions as you had already set up on the previous installation. If you did it last time, it isn't a big ask to get this done again this time. Just remember ... the ONLY partition that you re-format is the root partition "/". This will preserve user files and settings.

Having done that the rest of the install runs itself and is finished in 20 minutes or less.

Windows auto-updates without breaking working hardware and major upgrades are not needed every 6 months.


Oh yes they are. I have known a number of Windows users who cannot keep a Windows machine clean enough to keep it working for even that long.

Most Windows users are still running XP and don't have to worry about an upgrade breaking their USB.


But they do have to worry about not typing ANY personal information at all on their machine, lest a keylogger send their bank details off to a cyber-criminal somewhere.

BTW, I've never had anything break on me after literally hundreds of (clean) installs and re-installs of various Linux distributions. I simply don't upgrade any distribution, I always just re-format root ("/"). I think there must be a lot of masochists out there wanting to find a way to break something, and figuring that an incremental upgrade only like Windows does it (rather than a fresh re-install) is surely the best way to go about it.

"Of course this means that if you like, you can stick to this standard for three years or more, if you are after updates only (stability-with-security-patches) rather than cutting edge upgrades every six months. It is up to you.

Until you want to upgrade software that is tied a newer release.
"

Exactly. Upgrade to new release, and LTS stability, are antonyms. You can do one or the other, but not both.

So?

It is the same for any system.

"Upgrade or update ... either way Ubuntu is way, way easier than Windows. Several times easier.


How much faith can you have in Linux advocacy when people have been trying it for years? There's obviously something wrong with the software. Every year we get reviews that claim the latest version of Ubuntu is a 9/10 and yet Linux stays at 1%. Why is that?
"

That is simple. Average people can't buy it. It is not available in stores, and it is not offered to them. Some of them might have heard of it, but rarely ever seen a LiveCD, and even if they had they wouldn't try it because some nutter like you had been feeding them scare stories.

After all, it is the easiest thing in the world to check if your network, USB, printer, audio and wireless are all still working just while the LiveCD is running. If something doesn't work (not that I've ever seen such a case) ... then simply don't install this LiveCD to hard disk.

Having said that, Linux is way, way over 1% use. There is a huge PR/marketing incentive to maintain the fiction that Linux market share is only 1%, but its installed base is in reality way higher than that.

If we widen our horizons just a little to beyond simply the desktop: there would actually be more CPUs running Linux than Windows.

Edited 2010-05-07 14:35 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[8]: lethal upgrade
by nt_jerkface on Fri 7th May 2010 14:57 in reply to "RE[7]: lethal upgrade"
nt_jerkface Member since:
2009-08-26

How so? To upgrade/re-install Kubuntu, which I have just finished doing for my wife's netbook, is a matter of booting the liveCD (or in this case, LiveUSB),


Upgrading Windows involves setting it to auto-update and occasionally restarting the computer.


Just remember ... the ONLY partition that you re-format is the root partition "/". This will preserve user files and settings.


Who are you trying to convince here? I already told you that I have no problem managing a Nix system. For typical users though it is unrealistic to expect them to understand what a partition is. Windows and OSX don't require them to and neither should Linux.


That is simple. Average people can't buy it. It is not available in stores, and it is not offered to them.


It isn't sold in stores because people don't want it. The Windows 7 beta had more users than Linux even though it wasn't available in stores. There are a lot of technically proficient people out there that want nothing to do with Linux. Linux has unresolved issues and a major one is upgrading.


because some nutter like you had been feeding them scare stories.


Oh I'm the nutter. That must be why I think OSX is perfectly fine for new users. I must be a Windows/OSX advocate.


Having said that, Linux is way, way over 1% use.

And you base that on what?
The 1% comes from browser stats and it's likely a conservative estimate.
http://gs.statcounter.com/#os-ww-monthly-200904-201005


There is a huge PR/marketing incentive to maintain the fiction that Linux market share is only 1%, but its installed base is in reality way higher than that.


All a conspiracy I'm sure. Couldn't be that Linux actually has problems on the desktop.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[9]: lethal upgrade
by Hiev on Fri 7th May 2010 15:08 in reply to "RE[8]: lethal upgrade"
Hiev Member since:
2005-09-27

It isn't sold in stores because people don't want it. The Windows 7 beta had more users than Linux even though it wasn't available in stores

Touche.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[9]: lethal upgrade
by lemur2 on Sat 8th May 2010 10:32 in reply to "RE[8]: lethal upgrade"
lemur2 Member since:
2007-02-17

" How so? To upgrade/re-install Kubuntu, which I have just finished doing for my wife's netbook, is a matter of booting the liveCD (or in this case, LiveUSB),


Upgrading Windows involves setting it to auto-update and occasionally restarting the computer.
"

Nope. That would update Windows, very slowly, painfully, requiring several re-boots and a lot of download bandwidth, but it wouldn't upgrade Windows. not at all.

"Just remember ... the ONLY partition that you re-format is the root partition "/". This will preserve user files and settings.


Who are you trying to convince here? I already told you that I have no problem managing a Nix system. For typical users though it is unrealistic to expect them to understand what a partition is. Windows and OSX don't require them to and neither should Linux.
"

Linux doesn't require it either.

However, unlike Windows (I don't know about OSX), IF you take the simple-to-achieve step of moving /home on to a separate partition, then Linux plus all your applications can be upgraded to a new version completely painlessly in 20 minutes or so, without having to back up. I know this because I have done it many times.

You simply cannot do that with Windows, no matter how good a manager you are.

If you truly knew anything about "Nix systems", you would admit this.

"That is simple. Average people can't buy it. It is not available in stores, and it is not offered to them.


It isn't sold in stores because people don't want it. The Windows 7 beta had more users than Linux even though it wasn't available in stores. There are a lot of technically proficient people out there that want nothing to do with Linux. Linux has unresolved issues and a major one is upgrading.
"

I cannot fathom why it is so important to you to try to maintain this myth, but it is an utter lie. Shame on you.

Edited 2010-05-08 10:34 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 2