Linked by David Adams on Sat 31st Jul 2010 06:38 UTC
Gnome Yesterday it was announced that GNOME 3.0 is delayed till next year. The extra time has given the Shell Developers some more time to play around with new concepts and they have come up a new mockup. Here are the new mockups.
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Now its gnome's turn...
by leos on Sat 31st Jul 2010 16:36 UTC
leos
Member since:
2005-09-21

After everyone having a jolly good laugh at the disaster of KDE 4.0 (and it was terrible), Gnome is now well on track to do the same thing, but worse. KDE just had instability and missing features to contend with, but Gnome will also have a fundamentally new design, and after 20 years of tweaking small variations of the normal desktop concept with task bar will be incredibly hard to get right, or even close to usable.

The desktop environment has stagnated and that's a good thing. It works for most people, and Gnome messing with it at this point is far more likely to make it worse than better.

Reply Score: 7

RE: Now its gnome's turn...
by Zifre on Sat 31st Jul 2010 18:12 in reply to "Now its gnome's turn..."
Zifre Member since:
2009-10-04

Gnome is now well on track to do the same thing, but worse.

Nope, Gnome is actually doing pretty well. They haven't changed much of the underlying infrastructure of Gnome 2, just the user interface. KDE 4.0 failed because it was a complete rewrite with all new technology.

Gnome will also have a fundamentally new design

Gnome Shell is really the only major fundamental change in Gnome 3. And it's just a window manager. The apps are largely the same.

The desktop environment has stagnated and that's a good thing.

No, it's not. The desktop needs something new. KDE 4 is probably the most impressive desktop right now, and it's still just the basic taskbar, windows, widgets, etc. There is a lot out there that has not been explored.

I haven't really liked the Gnome Shell releases that I've tried, but I'll admit that I like the concept and it's nice to see something new for a change.

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[2]: Now its gnome's turn...
by leos on Sat 31st Jul 2010 19:52 in reply to "RE: Now its gnome's turn..."
leos Member since:
2005-09-21

"Gnome is now well on track to do the same thing, but worse.

Nope, Gnome is actually doing pretty well.
"

By what measure?

They haven't changed much of the underlying infrastructure of Gnome 2, just the user interface. KDE 4.0 failed because it was a complete rewrite with all new technology.


The user interface is what everyone sees. KDE had plasma which wasn't ready, and Gnome has their new shell, which isn't ready. The rest of the KDE framework didn't cause problems.

"Gnome will also have a fundamentally new design

Gnome Shell is really the only major fundamental change in Gnome 3. And it's just a window manager. The apps are largely the same.
"

So the thing that users interact with every day all day is fundamentally different. Just like KDE's plasma. The apps most people use (Firefox, Openoffice) didn't change there either.

"The desktop environment has stagnated and that's a good thing.

No, it's not. The desktop needs something new.
"

Why? Just cause? What precise problem would that solve? How exactly will a new desktop paradigm solve problems for users? Will it make them faster? Different just cause you're bored with the standard is not a good reason for change unless you're making a toy.

KDE 4 is probably the most impressive desktop right now, and it's still just the basic taskbar, windows, widgets, etc. There is a lot out there that has not been explored.


Many many things have been explorer and discarded because they didn't work. You developers see the status quo and think no one has tried anything else. People have tried tons of different things and they didn't improve the situation so they were dropped. But if you don't actually go and read the research and history you would never know.

Reply Parent Score: 7

Richard Dale Member since:
2005-07-22

KDE 4.0 failed because it was a complete rewrite with all new technology.


KDE 4.0 didn't fail, and it was actually very successful. It did exactly what the release announcement said it would do, no more and no less. Without an early release to give the application developers something to build on (that's all KDE 4.0 was), then later releases like upcoming very solid 4.5 release wouldn't have been possible. There were certainly communication problems, but that is a relatively minor thing compared with failing to deliver a new platform at all.

Anyone who thinks that new desktop environments will emerge just perfect all in one go, if only the guys working on them just follow the advice of the 'armchair release managers' on internet forums like this one, just don't have a clue about how hard it is to develop a new desktop environment. I wish the Gnome guys luck, and hope they can keep their nerve in the face of the unjustified criticism like the KDE community has had to face from a small but vocal minority.

Reply Parent Score: 5

RE: Now its gnome's turn...
by nt_jerkface on Sat 31st Jul 2010 21:43 in reply to "Now its gnome's turn..."
nt_jerkface Member since:
2009-08-26

The desktop environment has stagnated and that's a good thing. It works for most people, and Gnome messing with it at this point is far more likely to make it worse than better.


The Gnome shell is likely to be a boon for KDE. Just look at youtube comments of the previews, people are talking about switching to KDE and it hasn't even been released.

Reply Parent Score: 3