Linked by David Adams on Mon 2nd Aug 2010 04:00 UTC, submitted by kallisti5
Sun Solaris, OpenSolaris A recent vague announcement on osol-announce hints that something big is rumbling for OpenSolaris: "A number of the community leaders from the OpenSolaris community have been working quietly together on a new effort called Illumos, and we're just about ready to fully disclose our work to, and invite the general participation of, the general public." They have a website, and they're going to be hosting a conference call on August 3.
Thread beginning with comment 435048
To read all comments associated with this story, please click here.
Comment by kaiwai
by kaiwai on Mon 2nd Aug 2010 09:11 UTC
kaiwai
Member since:
2005-07-06

The problem is that currently they're still hugely dependent on Oracle for i18n in libc and they've yet to create a compatible replacement. Until there is full emancipation or at least some sort of time table so that a full distribution can be created external of Oracle - it'll be a difficult thing to get the traction required. I also wonder that give Oracle's willingness to hold back contributions will result in a second class distribution - and will that also impact on contributors who work for Oracle? will Oracle clamp down on what programmers can work on?

There is also a string of issues that need addressing; HAL being removed, the role of upower/udisk, the lack of external contributors today (or have they been put off by the difficulty of getting code included?), the replacement compiler - LLVM be an option or sticking with GCC? Is there any corporate backing? How much communication has there been with Oracle regarding this fork? are they killing off the OpenSolaris distribution in favour of letting a more community controlled one take shape which won't get hamstrung by internal Oracle politics?

Hopefully when there is the conference 3 August that some of these issues will be addressed because such not only affect developers but also end users as well - end users want to be assured that the time and effort they spent training, using, installing and advocating isn't a waste.

Reply Score: 3

RE: Comment by kaiwai
by libray on Mon 2nd Aug 2010 16:02 in reply to "Comment by kaiwai"
libray Member since:
2005-08-27

These are my thoughts exactly. The benefit of Opensolaris was that it was/is a pre-preview version of the upcoming Solaris, but backed by the company. You could be assured that new features would eventually make it into the preview version of Solaris and quite possibly,the general OS release. Will contributions from this go into Opensolaris if it continues or pre-Solaris? The relationship will be the most interesting to me.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[2]: Comment by kaiwai
by kaiwai on Tue 3rd Aug 2010 08:33 in reply to "RE: Comment by kaiwai"
kaiwai Member since:
2005-07-06

These are my thoughts exactly. The benefit of Opensolaris was that it was/is a pre-preview version of the upcoming Solaris, but backed by the company. You could be assured that new features would eventually make it into the preview version of Solaris and quite possibly,the general OS release. Will contributions from this go into Opensolaris if it continues or pre-Solaris? The relationship will be the most interesting to me.


True, there was always the ability to say in response to "is it corporate backed" to respond saying, "yes it is corporate backed' when advocating it. Solaris 'classic' might be great for the high end of town but isn't that simply ignoring small to medium businesses - those who make up the majority of economic activity? it seems that like Sun, Oracle is ignoring the small to medium business at their own peril.

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE: Comment by kaiwai
by Dubhthach on Mon 2nd Aug 2010 18:59 in reply to "Comment by kaiwai"
Dubhthach Member since:
2006-01-12

Looks like Garrett is working on it. I wouldn't be surprised if they will pull in stuff like this via *BSD.
http://hg.illumos.org/illumos/rev/c8da1d642945

As for the project. If Garrett is the lead then I think it should be very interesting. He is definitely one of the main kernel hackers doing code commits to OpenSolaris over the last 2-3years. He designed and implemented "Boomer" which is the new sound system which exposes an OSSv4 API. He's also done alot of driver work.

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[2]: Comment by kaiwai
by kaiwai on Tue 3rd Aug 2010 08:37 in reply to "RE: Comment by kaiwai"
kaiwai Member since:
2005-07-06

Looks like Garrett is working on it. I wouldn't be surprised if they will pull in stuff like this via *BSD.
http://hg.illumos.org/illumos/rev/c8da1d642945

As for the project. If Garrett is the lead then I think it should be very interesting. He is definitely one of the main kernel hackers doing code commits to OpenSolaris over the last 2-3years. He designed and implemented "Boomer" which is the new sound system which exposes an OSSv4 API. He's also done alot of driver work.


There was a move to port the BSD implementation over to OpenSolaris:

http://i18n-freedom.blogspot.com/

But it pretty much died around a year ago with no code every moving from simply some proof of concepts into reality. Garrett has done a heck of a lot of work so far - hopefully we'll see more people jump on the bandwagon and maybe provide a donation link as well because I know I'll be more than happy to donate $500 once I get working full time (once I graduate university).

I wonder whether there will be a move to get behind LLVM as the default compiler for illumos given how much backing LLVM is getting especially from Apple - although from what I understand its lacking SPARC support. With that being said I'd say the majority of illumos users will end up being x86 users anyway.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE: Comment by kaiwai
by sjvn on Mon 2nd Aug 2010 19:21 in reply to "Comment by kaiwai"
sjvn Member since:
2007-04-23

"The problem is that currently they're still hugely dependent on Oracle for i18n in libc and they've yet to create a compatible replacement."

Exactly. And, that will Not be easy to pull off.

Good luck to them if they do try it.

Steven

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[2]: Comment by kaiwai
by kaiwai on Tue 3rd Aug 2010 08:40 in reply to "RE: Comment by kaiwai"
kaiwai Member since:
2005-07-06

"The problem is that currently they're still hugely dependent on Oracle for i18n in libc and they've yet to create a compatible replacement."

Exactly. And, that will Not be easy to pull off.

Good luck to them if they do try it.

Steven


True, good luck - unless illumos are happy to break compatibility as so far as binary compatibility, it'll end up being a 'highway to hell" chasing something that'll making it even more difficult.

Reply Parent Score: 2