Linked by Thom Holwerda on Tue 31st Aug 2010 22:09 UTC
Legal Despite doing what I think are some great things for the American people, the Obama administration has a dark side. Joe Biden and many others on staff come straight from the RIAA camp, and it shows. Today, the Obama administration disregarded every US law relating to theft and copyright by stating that piracy is "flat, unadulterated theft".
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RE[10]: Screwed again
by ssa2204 on Wed 1st Sep 2010 22:28 UTC in reply to "RE[9]: Screwed again"
ssa2204
Member since:
2006-04-22


Aside from the Stimulus, please name the largest unsustainable big spending legislation that this administration/congress own. You may be surprised by what you find.


But before anyone can even argue against TARP and the stimulus, they must accept as fact that the stimulus had no effect. Unfortunately we have this nasty thing called reality, one where the real world data does not simply suggest but proves that without TARP + stimulus we would most definitively gone into a great depression. FYI, there are numerous sources, including the CBO (as well as that liberal commie bastion Moody’s Analytics) who have pretty much specifically stated this on record.

We find that the effects on real GDP, jobs, and inflation are huge, probably averting what would have been called Great Depression 2.0. For example, we estimate that, without the policy responses, GDP in 2010 would be about 6½% lower, payroll employment would be about 8½ million jobs lower, and the nation would now be experiencing deflation.

When we divide these effects into two components, one attributable to the various rounds of fiscal stimulus and the other attributable to the panoply of financial-market policies (including the TARP, the bank stress tests, and the Fed’s quantitative easing), we estimate that the latter are substantially more powerful than the former. Nonetheless, our estimated effects of the fiscal stimulus policies alone are very substantial: In 2010, real GDP that is about 2% higher, an unemployment rate that is about 1½ points lower, and almost 2.7 million more jobs….


http://www.economy.com/mark-zandi/documents/End-of-Great-Recession....

I wonder what the deficit and debt would be like if we went into another Great Depression? I wonder who would get the blame for that? What I think is really scary is that if we actually accept the argument that the stimulus and TARP spending was "dangerous", then the alternative given the facts is ludicrous.

"You are entitled to your own opinion, but you are not entitled to your own facts" -Daniel Patrick Moynihan

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[11]: Screwed again
by FuriousGeorge on Wed 1st Sep 2010 22:53 in reply to "RE[10]: Screwed again"
FuriousGeorge Member since:
2010-08-26


"Aside from the Stimulus, please name the largest unsustainable big spending legislation that this administration/congress own. You may be surprised by what you find."

But before anyone can even argue against TARP and the stimulus, they must accept as fact that the stimulus had no effect. Unfortunately we have this nasty thing called reality, one where the real world data does not simply suggest but proves that without TARP + stimulus we would most definitively gone into a great depression. FYI, there are numerous sources, including the CBO (as well as that liberal commie bastion Moody’s Analytics) who have pretty much specifically stated this on record.


By quoting me and later saying "FYI" it looks like you think I was making the point that "the stimulus is a failure", when in fact I agree 100% with your statement.

The point I was making was that, aside from the stimulus, this administration/congress has done very little to increase the debt, and yes, I do agree the stim was necessitated by the current economic situation.

For instance, Health Care was a trillion dollar bill, but the CBO says it will reduce, not increase the debt over 10 years.

Yes, the administration did bail out the auto-industry, but in the grand scheme of things that is a fraction of a percent of the increase in spending we've seen since 2000. Also, unlike Medicare Part D, the Bush Tax Cuts, or at least one of our Two Wars, it's easy to make the case that the auto bail out was necessary to save a large sector of our Economy.

Hell, I support a second stimulus.

P.S. I think it's worth mentioning at some point that I disagree with the current administration's position that priacy = theft. ;)

Edited 2010-09-01 22:58 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 1