Linked by Thom Holwerda on Fri 15th Oct 2010 20:54 UTC
Apple Is it an indication of Steve Jobs' (in)famous strive for perfection, or just stupid bone-headedness? The white variant of the iPhone 4 was first delayed for a few weeks, but those few weeks became 'end of the year'. Now we know why: the manufacturers Apple employs are apparently having issues matching the shades of white of the various components. This anecdote ties in nicely with a very interesting interview with John Sculley about Steve Jobs' ways of doing business.
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RE[2]: Hmmm
by alcibiades on Sun 17th Oct 2010 08:23 UTC in reply to "RE: Hmmm"
alcibiades
Member since:
2005-10-12

kaiwai, this is terminally confused about the way the PC market and industry is.

All PC vendors are packaging from a small range of standard components. You have three or four hard drive makers, all of whose products connect to other components identically. You have two graphics card vendors. Half a dozen main board suppliers, and only two processor vendors. Memory, there is more, but one memory chip is also exactly like another in terms of connectivity.

The only differentiation in the OS between Apple, Windows and Linux is Apple's attempts to restrict what their OS will install on. Otherwise, in how it relates to hardware, there is no difference. There could not be, if you think about it, because the hardware is identical. There is no more difference between a given Mac and a given Dell in terms of hardware than there is between two different Dells or a Dell and an HP. They are using slightly different selections from the same set of hardware components.

The cases are very different. But I don't suppose even the most fanatical Apple adherents maintain that what really makes the famous Apple quality is integration between the OS and the case?

This whole thing is a complete nonsense. What we have here is an OS which is slightly different but no better than the alternatives, being deliberately crippled in terms of what it can run on, and then used as the differentiator in a designer brand.

Its all about branding. It has nothing to do with engineering or design or integration or the rest of this stuff. It belongs to the history of marketing, not design or engineering. One has to say that as such, its brilliant. But that is all it is.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[3]: Hmmm
by MysterMask on Sun 17th Oct 2010 11:59 in reply to "RE[2]: Hmmm"
MysterMask Member since:
2005-07-12


The only differentiation in the OS between Apple, Windows and Linux is Apple's attempts to restrict what their OS will install on. Otherwise, in how it relates to hardware, there is no difference.


Strange. There is e. g. a huge difference in HW usability, though. I've never seen a Dell having something like target disk mode. Do HPs come with EFI? Why has DVI output been a standard on even the cheapest Mac laptops for years while HP's still used VGA, etc. etc.

I see Apple's HW design choices (and yes: even if the number of suppliers of components is limited, there's still such a thing as a HW design) less a restriction than a set of choices that affects their software. It's part of the platform they build on. E. g. iChat (AV) is a SW that directly relies on the availability of a cam on every Apple laptop. Even something trivial as sound output - I've never had a Mac with lousy sound output while the HP I have to use at work - even though it has a distinct sound card - has horrible sound quality.

Do you want to know why HP even bothered to put a sound chip in the PC? Easy - there are still way to much idiots that think a spec sheet tells the whole story. And that's why some people come to the wrong conclusion that it doesn't matter if you buy HP, Dell, Apple, IBM or whatever.
However, consumer thinks otherwise ..

http://www.tomshardware.com/news/macbook-laptops-consumer-reports,7...

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[4]: Hmmm
by Neolander on Sun 17th Oct 2010 13:38 in reply to "RE[3]: Hmmm"
Neolander Member since:
2010-03-08

Strange. There is e. g. a huge difference in HW usability, though. I've never seen a Dell having something like target disk mode.

What's that ?

Do HPs come with EFI?

I don't know about HP, but my Asus laptop has EFI (just set up to bios emulation as a default setting, for obvious reasons).

Why has DVI output been a standard on even the cheapest Mac laptops for years while HP's still used VGA, etc. etc.

Because DVI is highly overrated ;) No, seriously, as of today, screen connectivity is moving towards HDMI (which is a good thing since it finally unifies TV and computer connectivity). Most laptops come with HDMI connectivity built-in nowadays, except those from Apple (or have they changed their mind recently ?)

I see Apple's HW design choices (and yes: even if the number of suppliers of components is limited, there's still such a thing as a HW design) less a restriction than a set of choices that affects their software. It's part of the platform they build on.

Not sure of that. On a mature market like the laptop one, the configuration is now more or less standard : a keyboard, a screen, a webcam, speakers, minijack sound I/O, USB, wi-fi g+, legacy and HDMI video output, eSata (I really don't know why this one is so widespread now), and a CD drive. Bluetooth is not always there on lower-end models, don't know why exactly since it probably doesn't cost much.

So software does not have to support a wide range of configuration on the PC market, really...

E. g. iChat (AV) is a SW that directly relies on the availability of a cam on every Apple laptop.

Cam is more or less a standard features of laptops now, so this point is irrelevant. Moreover, what if I don't like video calls ? How come I am forced to buy a webcam in the name of some random software which I will not use ?

Even something trivial as sound output - I've never had a Mac with lousy sound output while the HP I have to use at work - even though it has a distinct sound card - has horrible sound quality.

Not sure what you're complaining about : speakers or minijack output ?
If it's speakers, well, it's no secret that good speakers are expensive, especially when they are small (because they have to defy the laws of physics through careful equalization, and things like that).

But if I want a computer just for work, do I need top-notch sound quality just to annoy my coworkers ? No ! So again, HQ speakers should not be a mandatory part of laptops.

Do you want to know why HP even bothered to put a sound chip in the PC? Easy - there are still way to much idiots that think a spec sheet tells the whole story. And that's why some people come to the wrong conclusion that it doesn't matter if you buy HP, Dell, Apple, IBM or whatever.

Indeed, spec sheets don't tell enough. But good vendors make a selection between the available products, and look for at least some level of quality when they go mid- and high-end.

Myself, I'm a bit of an Asus and HP fan, because I have had a very good overall experience with their computers, and a bit of an Acer hater because I've never met an Acer computer which did thermal dissipation right and computer spontaneously turning off because of overheating should have been left to the Apple III era. But I do think that all computer vendors (except Acer) now more or less sell the same thing, once you leave the low-end market where quality hugely varies between one model and another. Choosing a computer is only a matter of knowing what kind of keyboard you want, if sound quality matters to you, if you want bluetooth...

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[4]: Hmmm
by alcibiades on Mon 18th Oct 2010 08:14 in reply to "RE[3]: Hmmm"
alcibiades Member since:
2005-10-12

Target disk mode is a minor feature of the OS, its not because the hardware is any different. What it lets you do is boot from another PC's hard drive, as if it were an external hard drive.

Its of limited interest to Windows or Linux installations since the hardware supported is much wider and one install cannot normally simply be transferred to another. You could go into terminal mode I suppose.

My point was not that hardware configurations are identical across manufacturers, they are not. My point was that there is as much difference between different HP systems as there is between an HP and a Mac. In short, this is not about diffences between populations, but about differences between individuals.

We can all argue about which particular sort of computer configuration we would like, but the fact is, there are no macs any more. There are generic x86 machines packaged together by Apple, HP, Dell Asus or whoever, which differ by choice of components. And that is the only difference. Its not design.

Well, except for the case. Now that really is design.

Reply Parent Score: 2