Linked by Thom Holwerda on Mon 25th Oct 2010 19:00 UTC, submitted by sjvn
Ubuntu, Kubuntu, Xubuntu Well, this is sure to raise a few eyebrows here and there. Today, at the Ubuntu Developer Summit, Mark Shuttleworth held his keynote speech, and in it, he announced that Ubuntu will switch to the Unity user interface come release, for both the netbook as well as the desktop, leaving the GNOME user interface behind (but keeping the GNOME platform).
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RE[6]: Comment by mrAmiga500
by molnarcs on Tue 26th Oct 2010 14:56 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: Comment by mrAmiga500"
molnarcs
Member since:
2005-09-10

Wow mods, lighten up please! Modding down the original comment by the original poster was questionable, and punitively modding down his other more elaborate comments is unfair, but modding down this third party for merely politely disagreeing with the previous poster is just silly.

Mod parent off topic. Hell, mod me off topic too!

Great grandpa was a troll. He did what trolls do. Saw GNOME in the title, and couldn't resist the urge to say teh GNOME sucks. Fair enough methinks. I mean the comment that follows it, and the -10 moderation.

Edited 2010-10-26 15:04 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[7]: Comment by mrAmiga500
by sorpigal on Tue 26th Oct 2010 15:03 in reply to "RE[6]: Comment by mrAmiga500"
sorpigal Member since:
2005-11-02

Mod this off topic too!

The thread starter is arguably a troll, yes, but the post I replied to by nt jerkface was not and did not deserve any kind of negative mod.

I can't believe I'm defending nt jerkface... after all the mod points I've spent against him.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[8]: Comment by mrAmiga500
by molnarcs on Tue 26th Oct 2010 15:08 in reply to "RE[7]: Comment by mrAmiga500"
molnarcs Member since:
2005-09-10

Mod this off topic too!

The thread starter is arguably a troll, yes, but the post I replied to by nt jerkface was not and did not deserve any kind of negative mod.

I can't believe I'm defending nt jerkface... after all the mod points I've spent against him.


I see. It must be your conscience then ;) I widely disagree with some of his comments, sometimes argue with him, very rarely mod people down. I haven't checked your moderation balance, but when I see people whose moderation is <50% positive, I always think that those are the kind of people that use moderation as a way of expressing disagreement. Not cool. As a rule, I only moderate someone down if he is factually wrong and misleading on purpose, and typical flamebaits of course.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[7]: Comment by mrAmiga500
by segedunum on Tue 26th Oct 2010 17:15 in reply to "RE[6]: Comment by mrAmiga500"
segedunum Member since:
2005-07-06

Saw GNOME in the title, and couldn't resist the urge to say teh GNOME sucks.

The problem is that Ubuntu has ditched the default Gnome desktop shell environment for one that it is creating itself. To a greater or lesser extent that means that the Ubuntu developers feel that Gnome sucks. This mess really does nothing to expose the parent of this thread as a troll. In fact, it gives him ammunition.

What with the question being raised regarding using Qt as a development platform for Ubuntu people need to be asking what the state of Gnome is when it comes to Ubuntu and why it isn't doing what they want.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[8]: Comment by mrAmiga500
by molnarcs on Tue 26th Oct 2010 17:41 in reply to "RE[7]: Comment by mrAmiga500"
molnarcs Member since:
2005-09-10

The problem is that Ubuntu has ditched the default Gnome desktop shell environment for one that it is creating itself. To a greater or lesser extent that means that the Ubuntu developers feel that Gnome sucks. This mess really does nothing to expose the parent of this thread as a troll. In fact, it gives him ammunition.


Indeed (as to the last part of your comment ;)

The question is, why is this happening? Is Unity completely different from Gnome Shell? If they have completely different design philosophies, this move is understandable. However, this is not the first time some party decides that it is better to do it on their own instead of working with GNOME (as a project). Nokia, Intel and Novell comes to mind. See this:
http://blogs.gnome.org/bolsh/2010/10/25/ubuntu-to-move-to-unity-as-...

Ironic, isn't it - I've been hearing that GNOME is more corporate friendly than KDE for years, how it has better corporate support than KDE... and now look how the tables have turned! The corporations cited above seem to use the GNOME framework, but not for working on GNOME (the desktop environment) itself. KDE got Nokia however, then Intel came on board. Granted, their focus is more on the toolkit than on KDE, but much of the capabilities and features of KDE depend on the toolkit.

So the question - why is this happening? My own theory is the closed development model of GNOME and politics. It seems to me that major UI decisions are made by a handful of people that disregard input from the community. This is just an impression, and in some cases, development works better this way. KDE tried another path, and even today it is being flamed for their early release of KDE4. Once KDE4 became API stable, they released it, got tremendous input from the community, worked on refining every aspect of the desktop (including the toolkit itself)...

What with the question being raised regarding using Qt as a development platform for Ubuntu people need to be asking what the state of Gnome is when it comes to Ubuntu and why it isn't doing what they want.

[/q]
GNOME Shell, the most visible part of the changes in 3.0 (for the users anyway) is being ditched by one of the most prominent GNOME supporting distro. The release itself is being pushed back for the Nth time (KDE backlash?). And their response? Snarky remarks on Planet GNOME from their prominent developers:
Intel also initially made a ton of mistakes in Moblin around copyright assignment and closed development which breed duplication etc. though they seem to be past much of that now. Arguably Novell's development of compiz itself was extremely retarded wrt. open-ness, inclusion and community nous. Making the same silly mistakes left and right is nothing new. The sad thing in the bigger picture, is to see the community of companies grow (and fail) faster than the lessons / experience of past failures percolate through to their leadership.

So we are in a situation when almost none of the "traditional" GNOME supporting vendors work with the project. And yet, Michael Meeks (and others, I'm sure) seem to think that its their own fault. Intel's fault, Nokia's fault, Novell's fault (indeed, how retarted were they to develop compiz) and now, Canonical's fault. They should take the time and consider that maybe, just maybe there must be something wrong with the way they manage the project instead of pointing fingers to everyone else.

Reply Parent Score: 3