Linked by Thom Holwerda on Wed 6th Apr 2011 17:50 UTC, submitted by Cytor
Gnome The day is finally here, the day that the GNOME team releases GNOME 3.0, the first major revision of the GNOME project since 2002. Little of GNOME 2.x is left in GNOME 3.0, and as such, you could call it GNOME's KDE4. We're living in fortunate times, what, with two wildly divergent open source desktops.
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RE[12]: Sigh...
by sdeber on Thu 7th Apr 2011 07:32 UTC in reply to "RE[11]: Sigh..."
sdeber
Member since:
2005-07-06

Software design is not purely art. There's a science to it.

Always. But the practical problem is that we still do not have a scientific model which is mature enough to get the job done.




There's absolutely no way a random user can design a software experience better than a well trained designer with years of experience in the field.

I think you misunderstood me. I did not mean that the users had to design something or the designers had to do what the users asked. The designers are privileged to do anything they like in their own field. If they do not want the user to change something in THEIR PRODUCT, then they can just disable the customization options for it, like Gnome 2. It does not offer as many customizations as KDE does, and it is still good.

However, the designers are not supposed to FORCE the user to do the job in a way they expected. Gnome-shell is forcing users not to do multitask. And speaking that "multitasking is not good for human so we cut it off" is not a good reason. It is like typical mommy talk. The users are privileged to make their own decisions in their own domain. That is what I mean "it is not designers' business".

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[13]: Sigh...
by Mystilleef on Thu 7th Apr 2011 08:44 in reply to "RE[12]: Sigh..."
Mystilleef Member since:
2005-06-29

Well all products "FORCE" you to do things the way the designer intended on many levels. Take, for example, a vehicle. Now as a user, I might envision that the best place to put a steering wheel is behind the passenger sit on the floor. Don't ask me why, "it's just my preference." :-) But I can't do that because the designers don't allow me to do that. Instead these dumb designers decide to put the steering on the dash. Or a more practical example, I might prefer a 10 shift gear manual transmission in my car, but instead the designers build a stupid less powerful 4 speed automatic one in the vehicle.

The "job" of a good designer is prevent you from making errors and gently coerce you to use their products in the right way, the way the designer intended. So, yes, the it's the designers job to "FORCE" you to do things their way because they've spent countless man hours figuring out how to do things the right, most effective, most efficient and safest way, all things being equal, that you probably haven't put much thought to despite your subjective personal preferences.

Perhaps users should try to understand the design before the criticize or resort to subjective emotional tantrums about having things done their own way.

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[14]: Sigh...
by sdeber on Thu 7th Apr 2011 09:17 in reply to "RE[13]: Sigh..."
sdeber Member since:
2005-07-06

Perhaps users should try to understand the design before the criticize or resort to subjective emotional tantrums about having things done their own way.

Finally you got it. This is all about emotional stuff. I agree that all products somehow FORCE something, but Gnome 3 is OVERDOING it. Why? How can I say something like that? Can I formally measure it? The answer is NO! I say that because they are overdoing it. Why do I think they are overdoing? Because they are overdoing it. Somehow I feel that they are poking their hands in my territory or making decisions for me.

Again, they can do everything they like in their products, even they change the windows into ellipses, I can still survive, but enforcing their ideology is not acceptable.

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[14]: Sigh...
by sdeber on Thu 7th Apr 2011 09:27 in reply to "RE[13]: Sigh..."
sdeber Member since:
2005-07-06

So, yes, the it's the designers job to "FORCE" you to do things their way because they've spent countless man hours figuring out how to do things the right, most effective, most efficient and safest way, all things being equal, that you probably haven't put much thought to despite your subjective personal preferences.


In fact, these designers usually spend countless hours in thinking about making things right, they usually take into account every single factor that could possibly affect the product, and there is another thing which they usually do - ignoring the users' opinions.

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[13]: Sigh...
by silix on Fri 8th Apr 2011 21:54 in reply to "RE[12]: Sigh..."
silix Member since:
2006-03-01

" Software design is not purely art. There's a science to it.

Always. But the practical problem is that we still do not have a scientific model which is mature enough to get the job done.
"
well, all the work on HCI's and cognitive science i've heard involves models that DO exist, afaik...
the real problem is that, of those who design allegedly usability-focused software, few (if any) prove to actually know them, or the research, or even the basic theory and the recognized metrics behind software usability...

Reply Parent Score: 2