Linked by Thom Holwerda on Fri 29th Apr 2011 22:06 UTC, submitted by sjvn
SuSE, openSUSE Attachmate now owns Novell and therefore, by extension, also owns SUSE and openSUSE. With Oracle currently doing everything in its power to thoroughly destroy what's left of Sun's open source commitments, scepticism abound about the future of SUSE, and more specifically of openSUSE. Attachmate's CEO has answered some questions about the future of SUSE and openSUSE, and as far as words go, it's looking good.
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RE[6]: As far as words go....
by TemporalBeing on Mon 2nd May 2011 21:29 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: As far as words go...."
TemporalBeing
Member since:
2007-08-22

"[q]The Novell Client for Windows is one of the buggiest pieces of shit I have ever seen.


Yes, Microsoft has always made sure of that though various changes in the underlying GSSAPI interfaces, etc. Novell could certainly win an Anti-trust suite against them on the matter if they ever tried. Sadly, they never have tried and Attachmate probably won't try either.
"


I'm sure that in the 10 years XP has been supported, or the 5 years that Vista has been supported, or the 2 that Windows 7 has been supported, Novell might have been able, at some point to put out a workable client. They haven't been able to.

This argument is just excuses, and nothing more. The api hasn't changed between SPs, just major releases. Nice troll though. [/q]

Actually, MS did change it between XP SP2 and SP3. I believe they may have adjusted it between SP1 and SP2 as well. I was researching at the time SP3 came out (trying to hook into GSSAPI for authentication), and the changes were quite substantial.

Can't say anything per Vista/Win7 - though they had a dramatically different GSSAPI than XP did, from what I understand while Vista was in beta.

MS has been known for a long time - going all the way back to NT4 - for sabotaging the various systems that try to use the GSSAPI to do things like eDirectory/GroupWise so that their Domain system (now ADS) looks to be superior. Many just gave up and just piggy-backed on DC/ADS authentication (essentially capitulating to MS) - Novell with eDirectory was about the last ones to continue it to the depth they did.

Reply Parent Score: 2

BluenoseJake Member since:
2005-08-11

Ok, so SP2 came out when? 2004.
SP3 came out in 2008, that meant Novell had 4 years to build a stable Client for Windows, and they couldn't do it. They had 3 years before that. They've had 3 years since and the Novell Client for XP still sucks.

Argue all you want, but they haven't changed it enough that it explains Novell's incompetence. once in 11 years (XP) is not a valid excuse.

Vista came out in 2006, and they haven't got it. Windows 7 came out 2 years ago, still haven't got it stable.

so that's 7 years for Xp to XP SP2, 3 years for SP3, 5 years for Vista and 2 for Win7.

Admit it, Novell sucks.

Reply Parent Score: 2

TemporalBeing Member since:
2007-08-22

Ok, so SP2 came out when? 2004.
SP3 came out in 2008, that meant Novell had 4 years to build a stable Client for Windows, and they couldn't do it. They had 3 years before that. They've had 3 years since and the Novell Client for XP still sucks.

Argue all you want, but they haven't changed it enough that it explains Novell's incompetence. once in 11 years (XP) is not a valid excuse.

Vista came out in 2006, and they haven't got it. Windows 7 came out 2 years ago, still haven't got it stable.

so that's 7 years for Xp to XP SP2, 3 years for SP3, 5 years for Vista and 2 for Win7.

Admit it, Novell sucks.


FYI - you're just looking at the known public updates to the API. Remember, there is also the Windows Update mechanism too and Microsoft does push a lot of updates out through there that they do not publicize. So as to subtle changes that can break a lot of things like eDirectory there is more than ample opportunity for ways in which Microsoft has been known to use to break GSSAPI on Novell.

Now, you could argue that some of those changes were not intentional as Microsoft does not have a very good track record of pushing out patches via Windows Update that always keeps a fix in place. All to often one patch will undo another patch, and they'll repatch in a third patch. (Several public examples of this throughout Microsoft's history - e.g. WMF security flaws).

So whether it was intentional or not, it has likely happened in ways that Novell or anyone other than Microsoft (and in some cases even Microsoft) can account for in order to release a stable add-on product - which is what eDirectory/GroupWise is for Windows.

This is not a matter of making excuses for Novell. It is a matter of simply pointing out the history and behavior of Microsoft - known anti-competitive behavior at that.

Reply Parent Score: 2