Linked by Thom Holwerda on Mon 2nd May 2011 22:27 UTC
Privacy, Security, Encryption " on Monday reported that an online Sony gaming network has once again fallen victim to a cyberattack. This time, the attack may have exposed the credit card numbers of thousands of Sony customers from around the world. According to the report, over 12,700 customer credit card numbers were stolen during a breach of Sony’s online gaming network, Sony Online Entertainment. According to, Sony discovered the possible attack on Sunday."
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Member since:

Visa is not a debit card. Visa is a credit card. You can't use bank cards in The Netherlands without the PIN number. It's how the system works.

Reply Parent Score: -1

avgalen Member since:

No, it is how we are used to how the system works. In France there is very often a "no pin under 100 Euro" rule and that COULD work in The Netherlands as well. It is just common practice for companies that accept pin-transactions to use PIN-codes (as it should be)

Reply Parent Score: 1

Calipso Member since:

really? no pin needed for transactions under 100? weird. Wonder why they decided on that. Guess they don't think 99 is a lot for people to lose

Reply Parent Score: 2

vodoomoth Member since:

I contend this: in each and every situation (except tolls on highways) where I have had to use my bank card, I have always entered the PIN code.

I repeat, **each and every time**: gas, groceries, post office, Internet payments, etc. Sometimes (when using an automaton) entering the code is the first task you do, i.e. even before selecting what you are buying. The typical cases I can think of are post office operations and gas stations.

So I don't know what part of France you are referring to, but I've never experienced it.

The only possibility I can see what you refer to being valid in France is when the card has no chip on it and a swipe is needed. These are ALWAYS foreign cards as all domestic cards I've ever seen had a chip, which mandates entering the code. Moreover, I've worked for years as a cashier in parkings, back when I was a student, and I have **never** swiped a card (like it's done with American Express cards). In ten years of living here, I have never swiped my own card either.

Reply Parent Score: 2

sagum Member since:

Visa is not a debit card. Visa is a credit card.

Actually, visa is a company that provides transaction technology for banks. Its no more your passport is a national security badge because it's been stamped.

Visa have debt and credit card technology that is licensed around the world for differing types of banks and their accounts they create.

I personally have both a Visa debt AND a visa credit card from two different banks.

Also Visa or any other debt cards do NOT require PIN numbers to be used online. You might have a online banking security for your bank that prompts for a select number, random order of your pin number and maybe also some characters from your online banking password etc but that can also be set up with a credit card.

Reply Parent Score: 3

TheVendo Member since:

Visa can be either a debit card or a credit card, the same for MasterCard. Only Visa Electron and Maestro are limited to debit card only.

Reply Parent Score: 2

Alfman Member since:

Thom Holwerda,

"Visa is not a debit card. Visa is a credit card. You can't use bank cards in The Netherlands without the PIN number. It's how the system works."

I'm no expert on the matter, but as far as I know in the US, Visa/MC actually do handle the processing for all the debit cards.

My debit card has a Visa logo.

I don't actually use it, legally speaking I have no rights against Visa or my bank if they permit fraudulent purchases against my debit card. With credit cards, US law places the burden of proof on them.

It may be different in other countries that don't embrace monopolies like the US.

Reply Parent Score: 3

Soulbender Member since:

It may be different in other countries that don't embrace monopolies like the US.

At least in Sweden, a debit card is usually "compatible with" Visa, Cirrus and Mastercard. This means you can use it at any outlet or ATM that accepts any of those cards, anywhere in the world.

Reply Parent Score: 2

daedliusswartz Member since:

I was asking not being a smartarse, as I do not know.

As far as I can tell, Visa is a company and brand that provides fund transfer facilities.

I know of many places where Visa and MasterCards are permitted with I guess, swipe and go transactions, and I wondered if that extended to debit cards.

Reply Parent Score: 1

Lennie Member since:

the Netherlands and a few other countries are actually a bit of a blissful exception to the rule, there are a lot of countries with different situations.

Luckily it will change now that the Netherlands has chip and pin.

Unfortunately this might not be for the better, but worse. As chip and pin was already broken in the UK [0] before the Dutch banks even had a look at it, I guess we'll have to see how it plays out.


Edited 2011-05-03 11:25 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 2

mahiyu Member since:

I have a Visa debit card (my bank decided to switch from Maestro a few years ago for some reason) and it works in exactly the same way as a credit card, ie. PIN required in a shop, but not for online transactions.

Reply Parent Score: 1