Linked by Thom Holwerda on Thu 4th Aug 2011 21:38 UTC
Talk, Rumors, X Versus Y The Google-Microsoft patent war of words is continuing. Yesterday, Google (rightfully so, in my book) accused Apple, Microsoft, and Oracle partaking in an organised patent attack against Android, instead of competing on merit, claiming that they bought up Novell's and Nortel's patents solely to attack Android and its device makers. Microsoft struck back, claiming Google was offered to join in on the bids for the Novell patents, but rejected the offer. Google has now responded to this accusation - and to make matters even more confusing, Microsoft responded back. A public shouting match between two powerful parties? Count me in!
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Google & software patents
by ourcomputerbloke on Thu 4th Aug 2011 23:54 UTC
ourcomputerbloke
Member since:
2011-05-12

I do not like Google ... As a consumer, you should always distrust companies because their interests are diametrically opposed to yours. However, when it comes to software patents, and the importance of competition, I happen to be in Google's camp. My cheering for Google is based on the company's dislike for software patents - whereas many people simply hate Google because they are a major threat to Apple.


No shortage of Google ads on OSNews, an obvious sign of distrust?

So the dissertation here is that the only people who are against Google on this are people who are Apple lovers?

No possibility at all that there might actually be people who have very good reasons for either disliking Google, their nefarious data collection, and their very obvious - to some - future goals? Or people who maybe support non-trivial software patents because they are as important to innovation has non-trivial hardware patents?

There are just as many people beating this insane drum about Google being a major threat to Apple. How exactly? Ever thought that like thousands of other companies out there Apple're doing everything they can within the limits of the law to grow their business and protect their investments?

Why would they be scared of Google / Android? When it comes to accessible functionality for the masses iOS is streets ahead of Android. The article geeks frap about for a comparison doesn't in any way compare the actual OS user experience from a noobs perspective, it is purely a comparison of apps. In another more valid comparison of the actual OS this was the conclusion:

Apple has designed a wonderful piece of software in iOS 4 and all the other builds before it. It's so simple a gibbon could use it and take the final evolutionary steps on its own without having to bother with the millennia of generations in between. A huge percentage of the public would prefer it over any other mobile OS, but when it comes down to it, it has to take second place for the tech connoisseur.

The functionality, flexibility and fun of Android 2.2 simply leaves iOS 4 in its dust. It might not be as straight forward, it might be easier to throw off kilter, it might not even be quite as smooth running but it keeps you interested in your mobile phone and all the magic it can perform for longer.


Many people have bought Android phones on the recommendations of one or more of those tech connoisseurs, and from personal experience I know many that will never buy another, simply finding Android too confusing / complicated / inconsistent / unstable. Despite the rhetoric bandied around here, my personal approach is to tell people to go try out both, without the assistance of any salesperson, talk to non-techy people that they know who own one or the other, and make up their own mind. By a large margin those people have gone the iOS path.

The proliferation of Android phones has been driven purely by the carriers and marketing. The same thing happened when the carriers pushed Blackberry. iPhone came along, they pushed that, it became successful because it was simple yet powerful and feature rich compared to other offerings. But geeks wanted more and Apple wouldn't give it to them, so they stayed away in droves and lapped up Android when it came along. Many of those geeks work at phone retailers, and they sell Android phones on the back of their enthusiasm for it's power user features - things that the majority of the population would never use, and on Android couldn't work out how to use even if they wanted to. Just walk into a phone retailer and listen to them prattling on about multitasking this, tethering that, setting up a hotspot and customising your home screen, but ask them how to set up the device for visually impaired users or sync'ing it with your current iPod based music collection and they have a meltdown.

And the real giveaway is the tablet market. No carriers pushing it, after all there's bugger all dollars in it for them, and iOS is smashing Android despite there being about 10:1 advertising in the other direction. So again I ask, what has Apple got to be scared of? Anyone looking at this logically just sees a company doing what all companies who actually create anything do to protect their investment. If Google was in the business of creating, or should I say making money from their creations and not just from selling advertising, they'd be doing exactly the same thing.

Reply Score: -2

BallmerKnowsBest Member since:
2008-06-02

The proliferation of Android phones has been driven purely by the carriers and marketing. The same thing happened when the carriers pushed Blackberry. iPhone came along, they pushed that, it became successful because it was simple yet powerful and feature rich compared to other offerings. But geeks wanted more and Apple wouldn't give it to them, so they stayed away in droves and lapped up Android when it came along. Many of those geeks work at phone retailers, and they sell Android phones on the back of their enthusiasm for it's power user features - things that the majority of the population would never use, and on Android couldn't work out how to use even if they wanted to. Just walk into a phone retailer and listen to them prattling on about multitasking this, tethering that, setting up a hotspot and customising your home screen, but ask them how to set up the device for visually impaired users or sync'ing it with your current iPod based music collection and they have a meltdown.


You know, MrHasBean, you already provided a ready-made rebuttal to that claim... earlier in the same comment, no less.

"So the dissertation(sic) here is that the people who purchase Android devices only do so because they're brainwashed by geeks at mobile carriers?

No possibility at all that there might actually be people who have very good reasons for either disliking Apple, their 'gated community' approach to the iOS ecosystem, and their very obvious - to some - attempts to erect barriers to competition in the handheld OS market?"

P.S.
Are you ever going to admit that you're MrHasBean posting under a sock account?

Reply Parent Score: 4

RE: Google & software patents
by JAlexoid on Fri 5th Aug 2011 01:14 in reply to "Google & software patents"
JAlexoid Member since:
2009-05-19

Many people have bought Android phones on the recommendations of one or more of those tech connoisseurs, and from personal experience I know many that will never buy another, simply finding Android too confusing / complicated / inconsistent / unstable. Despite the rhetoric bandied around here, my personal approach is to tell people to go try out both, without the assistance of any salesperson, talk to non-techy people that they know who own one or the other, and make up their own mind. By a large margin those people have gone the iOS path.

And many more people don't have the techy friends. Or actually went into the store and decided that they were missing something in iOS. I have as much anecdotal evidence as you, yet it's very much irrelevant.

The only problem, is that you give non-techie people too little credit. A lot of them can easily select the right phone they need and evaluate all the upsides and downsides, especially women.

The proliferation of Android phones has been driven purely by the carriers and marketing.

And others got where they are due to magic dust?

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE: Google & software patents
by TechGeek on Fri 5th Aug 2011 03:54 in reply to "Google & software patents"
TechGeek Member since:
2006-01-14

Many people have bought Android phones on the recommendations of one or more of those tech connoisseurs, and from personal experience I know many that will never buy another, simply finding Android too confusing / complicated / inconsistent / unstable. Despite the rhetoric bandied around here, my personal approach is to tell people to go try out both, without the assistance of any salesperson, talk to non-techy people that they know who own one or the other, and make up their own mind. By a large margin those people have gone the iOS path.

The proliferation of Android phones has been driven purely by the carriers and marketing. The same thing happened when the carriers pushed Blackberry. iPhone came along, they pushed that, it became successful because it was simple yet powerful and feature rich compared to other offerings. But geeks wanted more and Apple wouldn't give it to them, so they stayed away in droves and lapped up Android when it came along. Many of those geeks work at phone retailers, and they sell Android phones on the back of their enthusiasm for it's power user features - things that the majority of the population would never use, and on Android couldn't work out how to use even if they wanted to. Just walk into a phone retailer and listen to them prattling on about multitasking this, tethering that, setting up a hotspot and customising your home screen, but ask them how to set up the device for visually impaired users or sync'ing it with your current iPod based music collection and they have a meltdown.

And the real giveaway is the tablet market. No carriers pushing it, after all there's bugger all dollars in it for them, and iOS is smashing Android despite there being about 10:1 advertising in the other direction. So again I ask, what has Apple got to be scared of? Anyone looking at this logically just sees a company doing what all companies who actually create anything do to protect their investment. If Google was in the business of creating, or should I say making money from their creations and not just from selling advertising, they'd be doing exactly the same thing.


Either you are wrong or Apple has no case. The way you describe Android, there is NO WAY anyone who isn't retarded would ever confuse Android and iOS. Android is just so bad that its not even comparable. So why is it that Apple is suing anyone for copying iOS. If its a copy, then that's saying its the same. So which is it? Are Android and iOS the same proving that there was copying? Or is Android such a pale comparison as to be an original creation?

To be honest, I think they are the same and that both Apple and Google copied from the people that came before them. That is why the two are so similar. But I don't expect Apple to ever admit that. Nokia had touch screen internet tablets long before iOS came out. Running a form of gnome or kde I can't remember atm.

Edited 2011-08-05 03:55 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 2

przemo_li Member since:
2010-06-01

Apple is not suing anyone for coping iOS!

Google did not infringed copyright hold by Apple!

Apple sue Google for infringing ideas, Apple have patents for.



Problem with patents for software is that every piece of code is ONLY idea. So you can patent anything, anytime. Also giving monopole is very bad idea in software! You then get companies not carring to innovate more (just because they can stop others).
And also because copyright is there in place to stop outright copping source code (and thats case Google vs Oracle). Software is unique field "protected" by copyright and patents. Oh and 20y protection is just crazy. After 5-10y you just get things as granted and build on them new innovation. If patents last so long, you just cant do (cause you can not make innovation without crossing tooo many of them).

Reply Parent Score: 1

jabbotts Member since:
2007-09-06

Nokia's Maemo Linux is GTK based. I'm not sure if it's a modified Gnome or just a GTK DE similar to Gnome.

QT comes to Maemo later. Keepass is QT based and works on maemo but is clearly not using the native GUI widget set.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE: Google & software patents
by Neolander on Fri 5th Aug 2011 08:31 in reply to "Google & software patents"
Neolander Member since:
2010-03-08

Don't reply to mrhasbean, don't reply to mrhasbean... Ah, man, I can't, this one is just too big.

And the real giveaway is the tablet market. No carriers pushing it, after all there's bugger all dollars in it for them, and iOS is smashing Android despite there being about 10:1 advertising in the other direction.

[citation needed]. Here, iPad ads are *extremely* commonplace, while I've yet to see an ad for an Android tablet outside of techie websites.

(On a related note, I've recently sent a mail to Gruber about a flaw which I was seeing in one of his articles. The mail was detailed and polite, explaining clearly where I thought the issue was and heavily giving him the benefit of doubt. He didn't reply. I should really stop believing that trolls can be saved.)

Reply Parent Score: 1

Thom_Holwerda Member since:
2005-06-29

(On a related note, I've recently sent a mail to Gruber about a flaw which I was seeing in one of his articles. The mail was detailed and polite, explaining clearly where I thought the issue was and heavily giving him the benefit of doubt. He didn't reply. I should really stop believing that trolls can be saved.)


Pointless. Why do you think he has no comments on his site?

Reply Parent Score: 1