Linked by Thom Holwerda on Wed 5th Oct 2011 20:36 UTC, submitted by zizban
BeOS & Derivatives Oh gosh, finally news that's got nothing to do with patents or smartphones or the comparing of male sexual organs. Haiku news! Michael Lotz has added preliminary support for WPA to Haiku, taking the first steps towards making the Haiku wireless stack a lot more useful.
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RE[4]: Comment by peteo
by peteo on Thu 6th Oct 2011 10:34 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Comment by peteo"
peteo
Member since:
2011-10-05

"It doesn't ship with every PC, even some major manufacturers like Dell and HP offer Linux preinstalled or even a bare hard driver."

HAHAHAHAHAHA.

"Mac OS X is certainly nicer than Haiku"
"Well that's purely subjective."

So?

"I'm curious to know if you have had only limited experience with Haiku and the BeOS way of computing, or if you're an old hat going back to the R4.5 days like me."


If had the intelligence to read my post, you would have read the fact I was a professional R5 user for years, and I've used Haiku more thoroughly than some of the developers.

Haiku is too little, too late.

Now move on.

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[5]: Comment by peteo
by Morgan on Thu 6th Oct 2011 10:45 in reply to "RE[4]: Comment by peteo"
Morgan Member since:
2005-06-29

"It doesn't ship with every PC, even some major manufacturers like Dell and HP offer Linux preinstalled or even a bare hard driver."

HAHAHAHAHAHA.


Are you implying that what I said isn't true? Or just a hysterical laughing fit for no reason? Either way, visit those manufacturers' websites and you will see several models with the option to preinstall Linux or FreeDOS.

"Mac OS X is certainly nicer than Haiku"
"Well that's purely subjective."

So?


So, not everyone feels the way you do and I wanted to point that out. In short: So?

"I'm curious to know if you have had only limited experience with Haiku and the BeOS way of computing, or if you're an old hat going back to the R4.5 days like me."

If had the intelligence to read my post, you would have read the fact I was a professional R5 user for years, and I've used Haiku more thoroughly than some of the developers.


Well in my defense the post I replied to said nothing of the sort. This was the entirety of your words in that post:

"Well, that's the problem. Windows ships with every PC (so essensially "free"), Mac OS X is certainly nicer than Haiku and - let's face it - Haiku is NOT currently more useful than Linux on the desktop."

All three points I addressed. It wasn't until after I posted that I scrolled up and saw your original post where you spoke of your experience. My sincerest apologies for any perceived slight.

Haiku is too little, too late.


I'm sure a lot of people feel that way, and that's fine. I don't, and just as you did, I expressed my opinion.

Now move on.


No thank you, I'm quite content to stay and discuss this with others. After all it is a Haiku article. Beyond this paragraph, I'm going to refrain from discussing the fact that you seem to be quite proud of your opinion yet you arrogantly insist that others keep their mouths shut about it. It's douchebaggery at its finest, in my opinion.

:)

Reply Parent Score: 3

v RE[6]: Comment by peteo
by peteo on Thu 6th Oct 2011 11:25 in reply to "RE[5]: Comment by peteo"
RE[6]: Comment by peteo
by KLU9 on Thu 6th Oct 2011 14:33 in reply to "RE[5]: Comment by peteo"
KLU9 Member since:
2006-12-06

""It doesn't ship with every PC, even some major manufacturers like Dell and HP offer Linux preinstalled or even a bare hard driver."

HAHAHAHAHAHA.


Are you implying that what I said isn't true? Or just a hysterical laughing fit for no reason? Either way, visit those manufacturers' websites and you will see several models with the option to preinstall Linux or FreeDOS.
"

I think... well forget what I assume about peteo's opinion and give my own. Your comment saying Windows doesn't come on *all* PCs is a bit like the person who protested about one of Samuel Johnson's generalizations.

Johnson: "There are no trees in Scotland."
Aggrieved Scot: "Yes there are! There's one not five miles from where I live."

The exceptionality of the riposte essentially supports the original generalization.

An ordinary consumer would probably never purchase a non-Apple PC that doesn't include a copy of Windows. They would have to:
a) know it was possible
b) care about the issue
c) actively decide they don't want Windows on their computer, and that they'll be satisfied with FreeDOS, Linux or installing an OS themselves
d) then search high and low for one

I might meet all those requirements. You might. A company's IT dept might. But 99% of the PC-buying public don't or won't. Which doesn't bode very well for a *consumer*-oriented home computer operating system.

Still I wish Haiku all the best and look forward to a 1.0 (or more likely for me, a 1.1) release.

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[6]: Comment by peteo
by cb88 on Thu 6th Oct 2011 18:19 in reply to "RE[5]: Comment by peteo"
cb88 Member since:
2009-04-23

yeah 2 dumpy laptops in the mid sized bussiness category and only 2 mid end latops in the enterprise category (and a bunch of overprised netbooks and such)

Yeah Linux laptops are hidden from the average person and well they are expensive as well. 2 Grand for an i5 come on?

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[6]: Comment by peteo
by zima on Tue 11th Oct 2011 01:43 in reply to "RE[5]: Comment by peteo"
zima Member since:
2005-07-06

""It doesn't ship with every PC, even some major manufacturers like Dell and HP offer Linux preinstalled or even a bare hard driver."

HAHAHAHAHAHA."

Are you implying that what I said isn't true? Or just a hysterical laughing fit for no reason? Either way, visit those manufacturers' websites and you will see several models with the option to preinstall Linux or FreeDOS.

Oh come on. I'm from one of the places where such laptops were actually fairly popular, mostly due to economic reasons.

The purpose of FreeDOS was probably somewhere between smokescreen and formality, so that the machines with it won't greatly inflate "sold without OS" metrics, hence possibly exposing their major, serious manufacturer (HP...) to accusations of promoting piracy. You couldn't actually do on them anything a typical user would expect.

With Linux it was often even sadder... basically, it was rare to encounter something which would work as it "should" (not like anybody really tried, probably). The shipping distros often omitted important drivers (too often there simply were no good Linux drivers for some components in those "Linux machines"), I've seen cases where it wouldn't even bother trying to start X (not like it could); or "with Linux" being just a Knoppix liveDVD thrown into the box.

Virtually all of those machines ended up with pirated Windows.

You have probably noticed I'm using past tenses above - well, for some reason (better deals worked out between MS and OEMs? Very rapidly declining costs of HW, hence the possibility to mask OS license price, while still greatly lowering the overall price? Influence of trade organizations?) such deals virtually disappeared. They certainly don't show up on "best-seller lists" any more.

And yeah, now ponder how it influenced the long-time perceptions people could have about Linux...



""I'm curious to know if you have had only limited experience with Haiku and the BeOS way of computing, or if you're an old hat going back to the R4.5 days like me."

If had the intelligence to read my post, you would have read the fact I was a professional R5 user for years, and I've used Haiku more thoroughly than some of the developers."

Well in my defense the post I replied to said nothing of the sort. This was the entirety of your words in that post:

"Well, that's the problem. Windows ships with every PC (so essensially "free"), Mac OS X is certainly nicer than Haiku and - let's face it - Haiku is NOT currently more useful than Linux on the desktop."

All three points I addressed. It wasn't until after I posted that I scrolled up and saw your original post where you spoke of your experience. My sincerest apologies for any perceived slight.

Yup, keeping in mind other posts in the discussion (especially if they are... a grandparent post of the thread one decides to reply in) might be advisable, might even bring some curious or enlightening revelations - for example, here http://www.osnews.com/permalink?492174 you say:
Haiku's lack of usability at this point is solely due to its alpha state; the goal is and always has been to be a full fledged and productive operating system.
...
at some point in their lives they were alpha quality and barely usable by the general public.
...
As for Haiku being "an end in itself" regarding its production state, again you're comparing an alpha state to fully released OSes.

It seems to clearly indicate that you consider Haiku to be lacking in usability vs. some other OSes, and that it being a productive operating system is only a goal at this point. Perhaps also that Haiku is "barely usable by the general public" (even if those exact words apply "merely" to an analogy meant to be illustrative of the current Haiku state, not to Haiku directly)

So... you certainly curiously adressed the "let's face it - Haiku is NOT currently more useful than Linux on the desktop." opinion. Essentially sort of repeating it later, few posts down?


(and I'm writing this as one of the few who have BeOS in some warm place in their hearts for a decade+ ...but come on, give me at least a browsing experience which doesn't lag behind what's available on "big three" platforms; it would be a good start, considering how it's one of the primary "daily usage" types now)

Edited 2011-10-11 01:58 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 2