Linked by Antonio Ospite on Fri 21st Oct 2011 23:35 UTC
Gnome Antonio Ospite explores Gnome 3 in fall-back mode and tries to make it look and behave more like Gnome 2.32 again. This summer Linus Torvalds made it to the news for complaining about the gnome-shell design; Gnome fall-back mode is the solution for those like Linus who can't - or better, do not want to - use gnome-shell just yet.
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GNOME Shell
by Jason Bourne on Sat 22nd Oct 2011 02:05 UTC
Jason Bourne
Member since:
2007-06-02

Actually, fallback mode is a very poor atempt to emulate what GNOME 2 was, and its destiny is marked and sealed as doomed by GNOME guys themselves. It will vanish at a certain point and no longer be present on future GNOME 3 releases.

However, there is a fork of GNOME 2.32 called "MATE" (as in MATE tea).

I would encourage and ask people who are big developers in Linux community to turn towards THIS project and forget about GNOME 3.

MATE does not conflict with GNOME Shell, so you can have them on the same machine (as for ArchLinux and Mint 12).

But my point here is this: Developers can go for MATE and pick up from the the point where ex-GNOME 2 devs left; change, improve and do what GNOME developers were expected and supposed to do in the making of GNOME 3. With enough taskforce, MATE could be ported to GTK3, get rid of ancestral GNOME 2 bugs, and be utilized with GTK3 applications. MATE can be big.

It already started, and if one person could take this step, I believe the big fishes, including Linus itself, could help this blow GNOME 3 away.

I see this as a light at the end of the tunnel, if it happens.

Reply Score: 7

RE: GNOME Shell
by Seaborgium on Sat 22nd Oct 2011 05:00 in reply to "GNOME Shell"
Seaborgium Member since:
2011-09-17

I have used MATE myself on Arch Linux, and I must state that it is an exact clone of GNOME 2, and has no major caveats. However, many extra applications commonly used in GNOME 2 that have undergone transformations when ported to GNOME 3 look quite garish in MATE, and many graphical tools of GNOME are not present and resolving these issues would resolve the preliminary problems of the fork.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE: GNOME Shell
by jbicha on Sat 22nd Oct 2011 05:42 in reply to "GNOME Shell"
jbicha Member since:
2008-07-10

GNOME 3 Fallback is the same as GNOME 2 and unlike GNOME 2 is actually still being developed (although admittedly there's not a lot of developers working with it).

The Mate developer would be much better off making Fallback better. It's a lot less work to maintain gnome-panel and some applets than all of GNOME. And by working with upstream instead of against it, his work would automagically get into all the distributions and he could use the official bug tracker and git repository.

The main thing that needs to be done is that most applets just need to be ported to the new GTK3 GNOME Panel library. (The 20 or so standard applets have already been done.)

http://www.vuntz.net/journal/post/2011/04/13/gnome-panel-is-dead,-l...

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[2]: GNOME Shell
by Jason Bourne on Sun 23rd Oct 2011 23:52 in reply to "RE: GNOME Shell"
Jason Bourne Member since:
2007-06-02

GNOME 3 Fallback is the same as GNOME 2 and unlike GNOME 2 is actually still being developed (although admittedly there's not a lot of developers working with it).


No, it's not the same. I want my configuration tools. I want my applets. I want my choice back. G3-Fallback is just a mimic. If you are able to run compiz with it and find a way to choose your mouse cursor and pointer size, then yes, it MIGHT be close to G2.


The Mate developer would be much better off making Fallback better. It's a lot less work to maintain gnome-panel and some applets than all of GNOME. And by working with upstream instead of against it, his work would automagically get into all the distributions and he could use the official bug tracker and git repository.


So you are suggesting that GNOME 3 be forked. Yes, that could happen. Why not. We have all the big guys (Eric Raymond, Linus and Co.) who are against the Shell. Forking G3 to behave just like G2, could be an alternative too.

The main thing that needs to be done is that most applets just need to be ported to the new GTK3 GNOME Panel library. (The 20 or so standard applets have already been done.)

http://www.vuntz.net/journal/post/2011/04/13/gnome-panel-is-dead,-l...


My experience is that extensions already make GNOME 3 crash prone, and they are not being 'embraced' by the GNOME foundation. They will be standing there as a shadow, since GNOME team wants the user not to be doing much of tweaking. And that gnome-tweak-tool is simply horrid, a plain hack. It's not even shipped with GNOME.

Nevertheless, we still have no "constructive" or "do it yourself" attitudes from the criticizers of GNOME Shell or GNOME 3. They're landing into XFCE, which makes the problem worse, as I am not fond of XFCE. They should criticize and point a direction. If Linus himself would just speak about users to go to MATE, or Eric Raymond would just call out for a new shift, these kind of things would start a snowball. If they're only criticizing just for the sake of criticizing, then we don't have much of a choice in the future. I know they're into another kind of programming, but... who knows.

All I know is that I like when Linus speaks out, it really shrivers the spines of all these folks who are doing crap. They all get mad. He has a very straight way of saying it, and it bothers people. And that's what I like it. There is reason behind it, and there is logic. He's more than Linux creator, he is kinda of a preacher. When he speaks, the congregation shakes.

Edited 2011-10-23 23:58 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE: GNOME Shell
by neticspace on Sat 22nd Oct 2011 17:38 in reply to "GNOME Shell"
neticspace Member since:
2009-06-09

I will pray for the success of the Mate Desktop Environment. I hope MDE can provide Wayland and improved user-friendly functions that GNOME 2.32 left.

Reply Parent Score: 5

RE[2]: GNOME Shell
by diegoviola on Sat 22nd Oct 2011 22:54 in reply to "RE: GNOME Shell"
diegoviola Member since:
2006-08-15

I will pray for the success of the Mate Desktop Environment. I hope MDE can provide Wayland and improved user-friendly functions that GNOME 2.32 left.


I've +1 you only because I want Wayland too.

Reply Parent Score: 4