Linked by Thom Holwerda on Thu 3rd Nov 2011 19:34 UTC, submitted by lucas_maximus
Hardware, Embedded Systems A big issue right now in the world of operating systems - especially Linux - is Microsoft's requirement that all Windows 8 machines ship with UEFI's secure boot enabled, with no requirement that OEMs implement it so users can turn it off. This has caused some concern in the Linux world, and considering Microsoft's past and current business practices and the incompetence of OEMs, that's not unwarranted. CNet's Ed Bott decided to pose the issue to OEMs. Dell stated is has plans to include the option to turn secure boot off, while HP was a bit more vague about the issue.
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RE[9]: Comment by Soulbender
by lucas_maximus on Fri 4th Nov 2011 20:47 UTC in reply to "RE[8]: Comment by Soulbender"
lucas_maximus
Member since:
2009-08-18

Half of it was an anti-microsoft rant .. so it was tl;dr;

There is not one single thread of evidence that OEMs are going to give you a BIOS option to turn secure boot off.

So far there has been tons of evidence that they will ... but people on here will continue to raeg.

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[10]: Comment by Soulbender
by zztaz on Fri 4th Nov 2011 22:23 in reply to "RE[9]: Comment by Soulbender"
zztaz Member since:
2006-09-16

Lucas - do you have any evidence that Microsoft will require OEMs to provide a way to boot other operating systems? Any evidence at all?

Do you have any evidence that Microsoft will require OEMs to provide a way to boot other versions of Windows? Would the owners of these computers like the ability to run newer versions? Would they like to be able to run older versions?

I'm not willing to assume good intentions on the part of any company - Microsoft, PC makers, Apple, or Red Hat. Microsoft has not stated in clear language that they want the buyers of PCs to be able to run the operating system of the owner's choice. Most OEMs haven't made owner control of systems a matter of policy; the few that have said anything have offered a poor work-around (disabling secure boot) rather than the preferred method of secure booting using owner-provided keys.

Maybe I'm a control freak. When I buy something, I think that means I control it. I don't like the manufacturer telling me what software I can run after I own it, I don't like movie makers telling me I'm not allowed to watch a movie I legally purchased in another country. When you sell me something, you shouldn't control how I use it after you have my money.

I want secure booting. I want to securely boot the operating system of my choice. It can be that way, if we insist on it. Secure booting could also limit your use of your own property. If that happens, it will happen because gullible people counted on good intentions. It will happen because people dismissed the warnings as coming from Microsoft haters and crackpots, instead of taking the time to understand the issue.

I don't trust Microsoft to protect my interests. I don't trust HP to protect my interests. I don't trust ANY company to protect my interests. I need to look out for my interests myself, which is why I urge you to protect your interests. Maybe all of the companies involved will do what I what I want, but it would be foolish to count on it.

Reply Parent Score: 3

lucas_maximus Member since:
2009-08-18

Summary of your post

"I think Microsoft is the number of the beast ... Bill Gates is Satan"

"There is no proof that something won't happen ... so I consider it a possibility"

However ...

The logic you are using is similar to saying "You cannot disprove god .. therefore god exists".

Do me a favour and get a clue.

Edited 2011-11-05 02:16 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[10]: Comment by Soulbender
by Alfman on Sat 5th Nov 2011 04:02 in reply to "RE[9]: Comment by Soulbender"
Alfman Member since:
2011-01-28

"Half of it was an anti-microsoft rant .. so it was tl;dr;"

Wow, you say you didn't read it, and yet you somehow still claim to know what it said? That's incredibly ignorant. I challenge you once again to read it and answer the questions without beating around the bush.

"There is not one single thread of evidence that OEMs are going to give you a BIOS option to turn secure boot off."

Freudian slip?

"So far there has been tons of evidence that they will ... but people on here will continue to raeg."

Maybe. But this rebuttal is a straw man that has nothing to do with the secure boot criticisms I made in this thread.

Edited 2011-11-05 04:04 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 4