The latest issue of The GNOME Journal features thoughts about marketing GNOME, a review of RSS feed readers for GNOME, a short preview on modeling with K-3D, an introduction to F-Spot, an introduction to Foresight Desktop Linux, and a review of Robert Love's 'Linux Kernel Development', 2nd Edition.
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Member since:2005-07-06
> What if MS decides to put their $$$ investments into introducing VisualC++ version X will we port all our C++ apps, run behind them and try to keep up - or pretend that our framework is good enough and live with Gtkmm?
And that's where my point is 
If MS introduces a newer version of C++, we don't care. There's still aCC, Intel C++, xlC, gcc, Mac, Borland and dozens of other compiler manufacturers and thousands of tools and billions of existing lines of code. Who cares for a MS-only version of a better C++? Even on Windows, I can choose between standard C++ compilers from different vendors.
MS is the only one who offers .NET tools. If they release version X of their stuff, 98% of all the related tools will follow. All the new articles in computer magazines, the students in university, everyone will switch. Mono not following the wagon? Unlikely.
I hope that my message of the "vendor lock-in danger" is clearer now
Member since: Even on Windows, I can choose between standard C++ compilers from different vendors.
Yes, on .Net you don't have a decision. But you can use another Framework -> Mono and you don't have the problem. Or you are a "old-school guy" and stay on Java, C++,...
I think the main problem is that people hear the name MS and get panic.
But the reallity is so simple.
People who code on the MS platform will use VisualC++, Borland C++ (with MS libs), .Net, VisualBasic, Delphi,... If you are on this platform and use one of this frameworks you will go with the framework from version to version.
People who Code on the Unix platform will use C, C++, C#, Python, the Mono Framework,... and the GNOME libs, KDE libs,... And they will go with their platform from version to version.
And than there is a group of people who develop cross platform for the Unix and MS platform. Maybe they will use something like Qt, java or maybe Mono. And like the other two groups, they will go with their framework from version to version.
But all tree groups have their platforms and their tools and are completely independent from the other groups.
Member since:>And that's where my point is If MS introduces a newer
>version of C++, we don't care.
And if MS introduces a newer version of .NET we don't care either. All mono needs to be is a functional implementation of the newest standard for C#/CLI and there it is about as good as MS. Sure there are is an implementation of the MS stack on top of Mono but with the exeption of ASP.NET they are insignificant.
Member since:2005-06-29
Member since:2005-07-06
I hope you see it. Just because MS has start something or has something simular has nothing to do with us.
Other C++ implementations can be implemented independently of Visual C++ and anything Microsoft does. Microsoft didn't invent C++, nor does it run in an environment Microsoft controls. Mono cannot do that. It depends on the standard Microsoft controls, and when a new standard comes along that adds new features to the CLR then Mono will be compelled to adopt them, or come up with their own ways of doing it.
Here's the cluestick. They're not inventing their own ways of doing things. They're not inventing their own APIs. A stated goal of Mono for cross-platform development (I don't know where this cross-platform thing came from to be honest) is that applications run under Microsoft's .Net and vice versa. If you look at the presentation from Brainshare they actively promoted Mono on the basis of taking a Visual Studio project, compiled for Microsoft's CLR and framework, and ran it on Linux and Mac OS. When other parts of Novell are using Java and Qt for that sort of thing I simply cannot see the point in investing resources needlessly, but I digress. You simply cannot do that without paying attention to everything Microsoft does with .Net and implementing it.
So, is Mono a cross-platform development tool (there are tools that are far, far better) or is it a development tool for Unix/Linux platforms. If it's the latter then you simply don't need to implement any of Microsoft's technology, their APIs or any of the features of their latest .Net version. Come up with a different roadmap. This "We're using Mono because we want a good technology and we don't care what Microsoft does" attitude simply doesn't stand up. It is a Microsoft technology!
Member since:
I'd be interested why not choosing a trusted and established framework for our platform?
Because the developer has decided that C# and the CLI is an interesting platform for the future. Other developer think different and work on gcj and gnome-java or work on C++ and Gtkmm or work on Python and pyGtk or stay on C and Gtk+,... it's not that there is now Mono and every other languages are dead, it's just another option.
And when MS decides to put their $$$ investments into introducing .NET version X, will we port all our apps, run behind them and try to keep up - or pretend that our framework is good enough and live with Mono?
What if MS decides to put their $$$ investments into introducing VisualC++ version X will we port all our C++ apps, run behind them and try to keep up - or pretend that our framework is good enough and live with Gtkmm?
I hope you see it. Just because MS has start something or has something simular has nothing to do with us. We just use an existing standard and create the best framework we can. The same we do it with every other language/framework.