Linked by ddc_ on Tue 22nd Nov 2011 21:29 UTC
Window Managers Calm window manager (mainly known for its shorthand name cwm) is a member of a once-powerful and now-declining family of minimalist X11 window managers. It is relatively unknown outside the OpenBSD community, but it deserves more notice.
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RE[3]: Mouse-less interface
by phoenix on Thu 24th Nov 2011 05:54 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Mouse-less interface"
Member since:

You misunderstood me, I'm not referring to slowness of learning, but to slowness of usage.

First, a mouse-based interface has been proven to be faster than a keyboard-based interface.

Citation needed.

I have yet to find a heavy-mouse user who is faster than a heavy-keyboard user. Especially when it comes to "typical" secretary work (document creation, document formatting, file management, e-mail, website updates, accounting, etc). A steno who knows keyboard shortcuts for everything is many, many, many times more productive than one who only knows which icons to click on.

While I'm sure that constant use of a specific interface over a long time can get you to be very fast on a given application, but across the board, mouse-based interface is faster.

I strongly disagree. A mouse-based interface is easier to learn, but a keyboard interface to the same mouse-based interface will be faster.

For example, to save a file in a word processor:
type filename

Is much easier/faster than:
mouse hand to mouse
move mouse to top-left corner of window, click on File menu
move mouse down to Save as, click
type filename
move mouse to OK

Second, a mouse-based interface is ubiquitous. A click on a window is the same in a window-manager, a browser, a media player etc. Keyboard-based interfaces each have their own choice of shortcuts;

That's a poorly thought out interface then, and not the fault of the entire category. The same can be said for mouse-based interfaces where sometime single-clicking activates an item, sometimes double-clicking activates an item, sometimes drag'n drop activates a menu, sometimes drag'n drop doesn't, some apps have menus, some have icons, some have ribbons, etc.

It gets worse when, as mentioned before, some frequently-used shortcuts become wired to your muscle memory and you start performing them everywhere, to hilarious results.

And that's different from mouse-based muscle memory? You ever watched a very proficient MS Word 2003 user switch to 2007 the first time? Or an MS Word 6 user siwtch to 95+ the first time?

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[4]: Mouse-less interface
by Moonbuzz on Thu 24th Nov 2011 08:49 in reply to "RE[3]: Mouse-less interface"
Moonbuzz Member since:

Alright, first, the obligatory links:

Second, cwm is a window manager, not a text editor, a terminal etc. While I'm sure find /foo/bar/*.c | grep baz | xargs whatever is a zillion times faster than doing that using a GUI, this isn't what we're discussing here (or at least isn't what I'm discussing (; ). A window manager, by definition, manages windows, for which a mouse is, again, proven to be faster than keyboards, and more ubiquitous. You may try to exaggerate with "you have to learn to click this button for this and that button for that", but that's not what the interface is, what you have to learn is left-click, right-click, double click, maybe wheel-scroll, and this applies to windows, menus, tabs, inside a browser, in an editor, you name it. And while I'm also sure someone who uses Xwm (replace X with your own flavour) for 3 years can make windows dance around with his keyboards, that is an edge case, which doesn't apply for the other 99% of cases.

Again, I'm not suggesting that you should do your coding, sysadministrating, dba-ing, or whatever in a GUI, I "live" inside screen, bash, and Emacs because these give me the superior environment for what I do. But I run all those inside Gnome-Shell because it does what I need, window management wise, and doesn't interfere with anything else. Same reason I use Firefox rather than, dunno, lynx. Choose the right tool for the right job. You won't code with your mouse, and you, I think, better with a mouse when you use a GUI.

Reply Parent Score: 1