Linked by Thom Holwerda on Fri 13th Jan 2012 16:20 UTC, submitted by moondevil
Windows And so the war on general computing continues. Were you looking forward to ARM laptops and maybe even desktops now that Windows 8 will also be released for ARM? I personally was, because I'd much rather have a thin, but fast and economical machine than a beastly Intel PC. Sadly, it turns out that all our fears regarding UEFI's Secure Boot feature were justified: Microsoft prohibits OEMs from allowing you to install anything other than Windows 8 on ARM devices (the Software Freedom Law Center has more).
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jabbotts
Member since:
2007-09-06

Isn't the UEFI issue being discussed here related to ARM based ultrabooks not tablets? And why, after plunking down money to buy the hardware, should a device owner not be able to opt-out of secure boot and apply whatever OS they choose to it? Your grandma won't be installing an alternative OS; great, why should that limit the computing functionality for those who would? Why should your grandma's using the microwave to make popcorn only be an acceptable basis for stoping me from reheating a spot of lasagna?

I also find it intersting that you justify limiting everyone's computing experience based on the opinion of someone who can't even explain what you do for a living let alone understand the potential outcomes of hardware locked to a specific OS for no other effective reason than one companies profiteering strategy?

Reply Parent Score: 7

lucas_maximus Member since:
2009-08-18

Isn't the UEFI issue being discussed here related to ARM based ultrabooks not tablets? And why, after plunking down money to buy the hardware, should a device owner not be able to opt-out of secure boot and apply whatever OS they choose to it?


Because you are being sold something that is a complete product ... you aren't being sold a tablet that can boot Windows 8 and other operating systems.

You are buying a device that is sold as running Windows 8. If you don't like it ... buy something else.

I also find it intersting that you justify limiting everyone's computing experience based on the opinion of someone who can't even explain what you do for a living let alone understand the potential outcomes of hardware locked to a specific OS for no other effective reason than one companies profiteering strategy?


LOL ... the idea is that most people IMO should never need to know how a tablet works or ever care. It should do what it does, never bother them until it gets wrong where they take it to a professional to get fixed.

Apple sells this as a feature ... btw you may wish to google Simon Sinek ... it will explain it better than I ever could.

Do you care how an Aircraft flies (I know quite a lot about it, I have a HND in Mechanical Engineering) but most people don't.

Do people care how a car works ... Nope.

Do people care how a washing machine works .. Nope

Do people care how a TV works ... Nope.

A Tablet is a product.

Reply Parent Score: 2

jabbotts Member since:
2007-09-06

If the option is a locked ARM device running win8 or another "complete package" which does allow another OS, you can bet your baby I'll "buy something else".

The point is, there is no benefit to the end user with this scheme. It does not improve the security of the owner's information. Malware will still be affective as will social engineering attacks. The only benefit is Microsoft's limiting comptitive OS on general purpose hardware.

And your apeal to numbers argument regarding users who do not wish to understand how technology works; so what? Why should Bob not understanding how a TV works stop Fred from doing so? Why should it limit hardware resuse with lighter general purpose OS when win8 grows too heavy for the older geenration Ultrabooks? Why should tech support people be locked out of bootable tools when helping those who do not care how technology works but want it fixed "now, now, now, now!!"?

Reply Parent Score: 2

Alfman Member since:
2011-01-28

lucas_maximus,

"You are buying a device that is sold as running Windows 8. If you don't like it ... buy something else."


If we continue on this path, then that may be the only choice we will have; anyone wanting to develop or run non-mainstream operating systems will have to pay a premium for niche hardware which explicitly supports it. Not only does this hinder accessibility of alternative operating systems for users, it discourages their development and significantly increases barriers to entry. Ordinary hardware, because of explicit restrictions, will no longer do dual booting, no user mods, no device re-purposing, etc.

This is a less desirable future than one where devices are open and unrestricted, and users are free to use their own hardware however they see fit. We need to be as vocal as possible about the issues to raise public awareness as much as we can.

Reply Parent Score: 9

zlynx Member since:
2005-07-20

Do people care how a car works ... Nope.


Except that quite a lot of people do. That's why my friends joke that I must have the only unmodified Subaru STI in the world. And even though I don't change the car's hardware or programming, I know how it works and I do care a lot about tires and alignment.

One of my best friends has already started modding his Prius. He's got a display that shows him all kinds of extra engine and battery data. He'll probably be running custom firmware by summer.

Reply Parent Score: 7

ulricr Member since:
2012-01-14

the author of the article istwisting reality a bit to drum up some controversy, because no one will be buying "arm laptops" as in a PC laptop equivalent. no one owns any application that runs on ARM! there is no point in running windows on ARM to use it like a desktop, that is not compatible with any of the apps people use PCs for. instead, you'd use an intel powered ultra book. this arm windows is all about iPad like devices, not PCs

Reply Parent Score: 0

Alfman Member since:
2011-01-28

ulricr,

"no one owns any application that runs on ARM! there is no point in running windows on ARM to use it like a desktop, that is not compatible with any of the apps people use PCs for. instead, you'd use an intel powered ultra book. this arm windows is all about iPad like devices, not PCs"

Ah, from a windows-centric point of view, I understand your argument. However maybe you don't realize that linux (to say nothing of android) does have existing apps that will likely run on these ARM targets, but only if they are not locked down.

Reply Parent Score: 4