Linked by Thom Holwerda on Fri 27th Apr 2012 22:00 UTC, submitted by koki
BeOS & Derivatives "Ultimately, Haiku represents a different way of viewing your personal computer. If you think that software shouldn't be riddled with bugs and incompatibilities and inefficiencies, if you hate being forced to swap out your hardware and software every few years because 'upgrades' have rendered them obsolete, and if you find that the idea of using an operating system that's fast, responsive, and simple is refreshingly novel and appealing, then maybe, just maybe, Haiku is for you." What fascinates me the most is that Haiku's not working on a tablet version. How delightfully quaint.
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RE: So, let me get this straight
by WorknMan on Fri 27th Apr 2012 22:18 UTC in reply to "So, let me get this straight"
WorknMan
Member since:
2005-11-13

They try to pimp this OS by presenting other OS's as being slow and unstable/'riddled with bugs', which seems like a straw man argument to me. Personally, as a Windows 7 user, I have 0 issues with speed or stability. And it runs fine on a 5yo Athlon 64 dual core CPU, so not like I'm constantly having to upgrade the hardware to keep up. I'm sure Haiku will run faster, but I don't recall ever having had Windows 7 crash, so I doubt it would be more stable. Of course, Windows 7 isn't stable under ALL circumstances, but if you throw some cheap-ass hardware with badly written drivers and all kinds of crapware running at startup, I'm not really sure any OS could handle that kind of madness.

So, what exactly will I be able to do with Haiku that I can't do with Windows? And I mean stuff I might actually want to do. I suppose it's kinda neat if I can play 4 videos at the same time as playing Quake, while having 30 different apps running in the background without the OS stuttering at all, but c'mon... let's talk real-world scenarios here. I bet it would be cool for audio/video production, but unless some industrial strength DAWs and video editors get ported to it, it won't be much use in that regard.

Edited 2012-04-27 22:19 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 3

izomiac Member since:
2006-07-26

So, what exactly will I be able to do with Haiku that I can't do with Windows?


Nothing. But, I used to prefer the BeOS a few years ago because it could do 95% of what I needed far better than other operating systems. Haiku is approaching that point (my needs changed).

Haiku is much faster, to the point that the sub-second delays on other OSes become infuriating. It's wonderful to hit Enter to launch a word processor and just continue typing since it launched instantly.

The simplicity of the OS is also underrated. Windows and Linux have bizarre behaviors because they are nearly biological in complexity, which increases the potential for problems and reduces one's ability to understand and fix them. Being able to have an actual notion of what your computer is doing turns the computer from the frustrating voodoo box to a simple hand tool. If I hit my thumb with a hammer, I blame myself and alter my actions because I understand what happened. If Windows crashes I get frustrated at it because I usually don't have a clue what went wrong.

I use the best OS for the job. While I could write a shell script in Windows, I'd usually use Linux for that. It's probably possible to get hardware accelerated video playback with my favorite post-processing filters in Linux, but it's much easier in Windows. OTOH, for the simple tasks that Windows, Linux, and Haiku can do, I prefer the latter due to its elegance. Your use differs from mine so YMMV.

Reply Parent Score: 12

bassbeast Member since:
2007-11-11

You actually notice sub second delays? What are you, the amazing Spiderman? I mean if you want to argue that X is faster than Y then sure, even though i have never used haiku (although I did use BeOS for awhile, whatever the RC version was they released right before going under) then sure I might buy that, but saying you can actually notice sub second delays? at that level how would one even know the delay was caused by the OS and not by something in the hardware or a badly optimized driver?

The problem with caring about raw speed anymore is frankly even the low end X86 units are so insanely overpowered it isn't even funny. I mean YouTube is covered with videos of guys playing games like Crysis on an E350 which is what you find in $350 netbooks now, so its kind of hard to get really excited by such feats in haiku when RAM is so cheap you can practically find it in Cracker jacks and multicores are the norm.

Funny that TFA makes a crack about tablets when that is EXACTLY the kind of market Haiku should be targeting. people don't expect app compatibility between devices there like they do X86 desktops and laptops and if haiku is as lean when multitasking as the original beOS then that would probably be a really sweet tablet.

Reply Parent Score: 3

einr Member since:
2012-02-15

It's a better designed operating system, almost entirely free of the MS-DOS and PC-AT legacy plague. I'm sure your Windows 7 installation is fast enough, but if you tried it, you'd be flabbergasted at just how incredibly responsive Haiku is. Whole different league. It boots in around 10 seconds on my four year old Atom-based netbook, everything just pops up as soon as you click on it -- it's really remarkable.

It's a better designed operating system; that doesn't mean it has better applications. This is still alpha-stage software and porting applications from GNU/Linux or Windows or Mac OS is not straightforward.

So the answer is: there's literally nothing right now you can do with Haiku that you can't do with Windows, except marvel at the sheer accomplishment.

Reply Parent Score: 0

Bill Shooter of Bul Member since:
2006-07-14

Listen, I loved BeOS and love Haiku as well. But, you have to be honest in your critisims of other operating systems. Throwing around things like "free of MS_DOS PC-AT legacy plague" Is just plain dishonest. There isn't any DOS legacy left in windows 7. If there is, what is it and why does it present a problem?

I think you are just commenting about the speed and responsiveness of the gui. Cool. Just leave it at that :" Hakui has a more responsive Gui". Don't blame it on DOS or pc-at, thats just absurd. Otherwise we could likewise say that Windows is better because it doesn't have that legacy at& t hobbit design plague.

Reply Parent Score: 2

Tuishimi Member since:
2005-07-06

Actually I think there are things I cannot do, still. I need to use a VPN that runs very specific cisco software... I am pretty sure it won't run on BeOS yet. I wish it would but...

Ah well. I do so miss my BeOS...

Reply Parent Score: 2

BluenoseJake Member since:
2005-08-11

There is no MSDOS in Windows NT, never has been. Windows 7 is the latest version of NT (Windows 8 is not RTM yet). OS X also has never been accused of being related to MSDOS, and neither has Linux or BSD.

The only real remnant of the AT era left in a modern PC is the BIOS, and new PCs are moving away from that.

Really, your whole post is just nonsense, let Haiku stand up on it's own, without BS such as this. I mean really, come on.

Reply Parent Score: 3

Soulbender Member since:
2005-08-18

It's a better designed operating system, almost entirely free of the MS-DOS


It's entirely free of MS-DOS. Just like any other modern operating system today, except FreeDOS.

and PC-AT legacy plague.


It runs on PC, doesnt it? It supports IDE devices, right? Then it's not free of the PC-AT plague.

you'd be flabbergasted at just how incredibly responsive Haiku is.


Not really, I used BeOS so I know how responsive it is. On the other hand, DOS-SHELL was pretty responsive too..

It boots in around 10 seconds

It's a better designed operating system


There are more parameters to better design than raw speed.

Edited 2012-04-29 03:05 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 2

zima Member since:
2005-07-06

It's a better designed operating system, almost entirely free of the MS-DOS and PC-AT legacy plague. I'm sure your Windows 7 installation is fast enough, but if you tried it, you'd be flabbergasted at just how incredibly responsive Haiku is.

"free of the [...] PC-AT legacy plague" - it is Haiku that runs only on IA-32, while NT on... a few more architectures (NT didn't even start on x86)

And yeah, Haiku is damn responsive in doing so little as it does (that minimal approach might be what is desired of course, but lets be honest here...)

Reply Parent Score: 2

phoehne Member since:
2006-08-26

Personally, as a Windows 7 user, I have 0 issues with speed or stability.


Lucky you. The other billion or so users - not so much.

You wouldn't watch a movie while playing quake (that would be ridiculous) so much as you might move to much more intelligent NPC's, enemies, or maybe much higher fidelity rendering, if you had a significantly more efficient operating system/rendering pipeline. You are constrained by the physical limits of your hardware. The O/S is a tax on that. Like taxes, some of what you pay comes back to you in better services. A certain amount is just lost as waste because the O/S is not efficient.

I'm stunned sometimes by how bad Windows can be. Not all the time, but sometimes. Not just comparing it to BeOS, but other operating systems. With dual booting machines I've sometimes scratched my head in wonder as to why something (like running multiple streams of video back in the NT 4 days) could work so well in one O/S but Windows just kind of screws the pooch. It's not everything, but I think there are some areas where Windows just kind of sucks. And it's not 250ms vs 198ms. It's 5 minutes vs 5 seconds. They say that the 8 kernel has been cleaned up to get its memory footprint down, so hopefully gooder performance in the future.

Of course, there are some things you give up with good design, like long boot times. Like being able to start booting and be able to get up and get a cup of coffee before the system is ready to use. In fact, I sometimes think I could grow the beans, dry them, hump them up from Columbia on a pack mule, toast them, grind them, vacuum pack them, sell them to my Grocery store, go in, buy them back, take them home, brew a pot of coffee.... nope still not done booting.

Reply Parent Score: 0

moondevil Member since:
2005-07-08

The Windows kernel is quite good.

The Windows Internals series is a nice eye opener how everything works.

http://shop.oreilly.com/product/0790145305930.do

In the early NT days, it was the only fully multi-threaded kernel, before the UNIX systems adopted multi-threading at the kernel level.

Many of the Windows issues that people talk about, are at the application level, not at the kernel. For example, the way explorer behaves when handling lots of files.

Reply Parent Score: 1

alexz Member since:
2012-02-25

I can watch a 1080p youtube video while playing WoW at 40fps in high settings on my 4 years old core2duo HP laptop running windows 7 with an external hdmi monitor.

Windows 7 has its performance problem, but managing/sharing resources isn't one of these problem.

Wake me up when Haiku can do half of what I need to be done on a computer.

Reply Parent Score: 1