Linked by diegocg on Sun 13th May 2012 23:48 UTC
Linux Lennart Poettering, the author of systemd, has announced: "I just put a first version of a wiki document together that lists a couple of easy optimizations to get your boot times down to [less than] 2s. It also includes a list of suggested things to hack on to get even quicker boot-ups."
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RE[4]: Comment by Drumhellar
by Gullible Jones on Mon 14th May 2012 03:58 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Comment by Drumhellar"
Gullible Jones
Member since:
2006-05-23

I realize you're not being serious, but... That is not the same kind of functionality. Way too much stuff on Linux is tied to heavy desktop environments - networking and automatic power management in particular stand out. Getting this stuff working under a standalone WM tends to require extensive configuration or ugly, insecure hacks.

(And in the case of NetworkManager, it doesn't work in a command line environment, period. nmcli is a complete joke.)

Pretty annoying. Especially seeing as laptops, which could theoretically benefit the most from a lightweight environment, are currently left with crippled functionality.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[5]: Comment by Drumhellar
by gan17 on Mon 14th May 2012 04:19 in reply to "RE[4]: Comment by Drumhellar"
gan17 Member since:
2008-06-03

I realize you're not being serious, but... That is not the same kind of functionality. Way too much stuff on Linux is tied to heavy desktop environments - networking and automatic power management in particular stand out.

Yes, it was mainly tongue-in-cheek as I understand most people don't like tilers, but I have to disagree with you on the networking and power-management. There's ceni, netcfg and good ol' wpasupplicant for networking and the glorious but little-known Linux-PHC undervolting (in combination with the usual cpufreq) which used to give me more juice than what the manufacturer stated on the box. I say "used to" because the battery is a bit old now, sadly. As far as I know, these work in almost any DE or WM, though not quite automated as what you might find in Gnome or KDE.

The only downside (for some people) is....

Getting this stuff working under a standalone WM tends to require extensive configuration or ugly, insecure hacks.

.... like you mentioned. You do need to spend a little time editing configs. No security implications that I've noticed (so far) though, but then again, Arch isn't exactly an OpenBSD rival on that front.

Oh, and some tilers come with systray functionality these days, so you can pretty much dock your nm or wicd or cpu-scaling applets there as well.

Apologies for going somewhat off-topic.

Edited 2012-05-14 04:25 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 3

Gullible Jones Member since:
2006-05-23

wpa_supplicant provides no simple way to connect to an encrypted network on the fly; you have to be able to write to the wpa_supplicant.conf file.

ceni requires the root password.

Suspending and hibernating the computer requires long, unintuitive dbus commands. Either that or sudo, which as I understand it is a security hole.

Mounting stuff in a file manager requires either a working consolekit session (which is not possible on many distros, ranging from Debian Squeeze to Ubuntu 12.04), or messing around with PKLA files (which is again probably a security hazard). Alternatively you can use one of the various immensely bloated login managers...

I actually posted a rant about this on the Arch forums, and a lot of people seemed to agree with me. Basically it appears to me that, while Linux based GUIs for doing this stuff have improved recently, the friendly CLI environment to back it up isn't quite there.

Edit: And I should point out that by "friendly" I mean "friendly to experienced users," not "friendly to complete novices." No CLI is friendly to novices, but a good CLI must be friendly to people who know what they're doing; i.e. it shouldn't make things more complicated than they have to be. And almost every Linux CLI thing that involves wireless, power management, or device mounting makes things more complicated than they have to be.

Edited 2012-05-14 14:56 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[6]: Comment by Drumhellar
by raboof on Mon 14th May 2012 16:28 in reply to "RE[5]: Comment by Drumhellar"
raboof Member since:
2005-07-24

I understand most people don't like tilers

Another tiler-junkie here ;) (Notion fan)

but I have to disagree with you on the networking and power-management. There's ceni, netcfg and good ol' wpasupplicant for networking...

some tilers come with systray functionality these days, so you can pretty much dock your nm or wicd or cpu-scaling applets there as well.


Indeed I personally am pretty happy with wicd-client for configuring connections to ad-hoc networks. The systray icon is a nice (though optional) extra.

Reply Parent Score: 2