Linked by Thom Holwerda on Thu 14th Jun 2012 02:49 UTC
Apple After a proper teardown, iFixit concludes that the new MacBook Pro has no user-serviceable parts at all, which some think is a really bad thing. I honestly don't know - I mean, my ZenBook isn't particularly user-serviceable either, and my smartphones, tablets, and whatnot are pretty much entirely soldered together as well. What do you guys make of this?
Thread beginning with comment 521984
To view parent comment, click here.
To read all comments associated with this story, please click here.
RE: Sounds like a challenge.
by zima on Thu 14th Jun 2012 07:55 UTC in reply to "Sounds like a challenge."
zima
Member since:
2005-07-06

I pine for the old days of cars and computers, where one could be stripped down and rebuilt with nothing more than a leatherman multi-tool. There was something great about being able to service your machines yourself, a sense of independence and importance, that you really knew your machine and how you were using it.

...and about them being less efficient, more polluting, notably less reliable overall? (also without complex active safety systems, mostly in brakes; or without delicate passive safety systems that must never be triggered inadvertently - come on, there are essentially six explosive charges inside the cabin of my car, which is probably at most fairly average at that, being decade+ old; you really don't want unlicensed people messing around those)

Just saying; don't look at the past through too rosy glasses.

Reply Parent Score: 3

lucas_maximus Member since:
2009-08-18

Less reliable is a bit of a misnomer.

I have a "unreliable" 1970s Peugeot Sports Tourer Bicycle, every maintenence job can be done via allen keys, screwdriver and a hammer.

No it isn't as fast a modern push bike, it isn't a light, but it doesn't break and nobody will steal it because it isn't worth anything.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[3]: Sounds like a challenge.
by zima on Thu 14th Jun 2012 09:15 in reply to "RE[2]: Sounds like a challenge."
zima Member since:
2005-07-06

Oh come on, that wasn't really about bicycles... ;) they hardly changed in the last 4 decades, have attained close to optimal form quite some time ago. Also no new tools required.

And BTW, it's not at all clear which of us has a more ghetto bike from the 1970s: http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Romet_Wagant (my Wagant has more basic dérailleur lever and more "classic" front lamp; it spent a decade+ in few sheds, in pieces)

Yeah, there are bicycles from same crazy materials and so on - but people in general don't really choose those; just like they don't drive around in rally cars ...even (hm, especially) if they do drive or ride in one at rallies.

Reply Parent Score: 2

spiderman Member since:
2008-10-23

I think he didn't want to say he missed the pollution or the reliability. He just said he missed the serviceability.
Pollution is a con.
Reliability is a pro.
Serviceability is a pro.
I take this macbook over a 486DX2-33 of course, but if there was 2 models with same look, same price, same content, one serviceable and the other not,only an idiot would take the inferior model.
I think what he meant was that there has been a regression in that area.

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[3]: Sounds like a challenge.
by zima on Thu 14th Jun 2012 09:23 in reply to "RE[2]: Sounds like a challenge."
zima Member since:
2005-07-06

All I meant: keep things in perspective - it's not like we didn't get very nice benefits in exchange for lower serviceability, a result of technology advancement (that was the goal - not complexity for the sake of it, not limited serviceability itself).

People too often forget that the past wasn't, in fact, better; start to believe, step by step, in myths about it.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[2]: Sounds like a challenge.
by rexstuff on Thu 14th Jun 2012 22:37 in reply to "RE: Sounds like a challenge."
rexstuff Member since:
2007-04-06

I am not so sure that those are mutually exclusive.

Yes, in addition to being faster, lighter, stronger, etc, we lost the ability to do the service ourselves, but I'm not sure that that has to be the case.

Why can't we build a car or computer that is user-serviceable while still making use of the modern engineering that gave us these benefits?

For instance, I may not be able to repair an EFI module the same way I could a carbuerrator, granted, but why can't I replace it?

A modern car with user serviceability in mind may not be quite as fast or efficient or even as cheap, but I wonder if there wouldn't be a market for it...

Reply Parent Score: 4

RE[3]: Sounds like a challenge.
by zima on Fri 15th Jun 2012 01:53 in reply to "RE[2]: Sounds like a challenge."
zima Member since:
2005-07-06

Why can't we build a car or computer that is user-serviceable while still making use of the modern engineering that gave us these benefits?

Because we don't want to pay for it. Such "simple" things as reliable (non-trained-user-reliable) connectors maintaining size, or withstanding environmental (as in, in the engine compartment) conditions ...it would add up. Plus there's the reliability of computerised control in safety-critical road conditions.

You most likely wouldn't pay for it:

A modern car with user serviceability in mind may not be quite as fast or efficient or even as cheap, but I wonder if there wouldn't be a market for it...

You wonder, not declare you would buy it? Plus, really, there is a market for it - notably in the form of military-oriented vehicles (but it's easy to get civilian versions), which are roughly that.
Oh yeah, and they tend to be quite expensive (well, unless you're willing to settle for something not very modern and without many comforts, like Niva or UAZ-452; closest outside such heritage is possibly Dacia Logan or Tata Nano, even quite cheap, but many people simply laugh at them...)


And really, keep things in perspective - yes, sure, it was a good thing that you were able to repair a car yourself back in the day, but mostly because they broke much more often in the first place (and actually, one has to wonder if a major cause of that were sub-standard repairs)

Edited 2012-06-15 02:12 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 2