Linked by Thom Holwerda on Wed 11th Jul 2012 10:15 UTC
In the News Andrew Binstock interviews Alan Kay, and there are just so many fantastic quotes and insights in there I have no idea what to pick as the OSNews item. This one? "Pop culture holds a disdain for history. Pop culture is all about identity and feeling like you're participating. It has nothing to do with cooperation, the past or the future - it's living in the present," Kay argues, "I think the same is true of most people who write code for money. They have no idea where [their culture came from] - and the Internet was done so well that most people think of it as a natural resource like the Pacific Ocean, rather than something that was man-made. When was the last time a technology with a scale like that was so error-free? The Web, in comparison, is a joke. The Web was done by amateurs." What about this gem? "I was never a great programmer. That's what got me into making more powerful programming languages." Or, my personal favourite: "My interest in education is unglamorous. I don't have an enormous desire to help children, but I have an enormous desire to create better adults." Read this. Now. That's an order.
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RE[2]: The guy is an Elitist
by olefiver on Wed 11th Jul 2012 18:41 UTC in reply to "RE: The guy is an Elitist"
olefiver
Member since:
2008-04-04

Uh, is getting Socrates into heaven some sort of major theological issue that I've never heard of?

It's not specifically about Socrates, but Socrates is often used as an example of a non-christian that should be admitted into heaven, but since he was not baptized, he can't.

I would say it is a theological problem, but not major one, so I'm not surprised that you haven't heard about it.
Although I've not heard about this in relation to not being baptized.
I remember it as all good men that hasn't heard of Jesus and his word can't get into heaven, but instead of hell those get dropped into Limbo (or something like it) where they shall live out the afterlife not in eternal damnation, 'cause they haven't heard the good word, but also not in the presence of God, 'cause they haven't heard the good word...

Anyhoo, I kinda liked the solution the mormons came up with. Which is the reason Kay brought the whole thing up, as an analogy to Bob Barton not getting a Turing 'cause the Turing isn't awarded posthumously.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[3]: The guy is an Elitist
by robertson on Thu 12th Jul 2012 14:41 in reply to "RE[2]: The guy is an Elitist"
robertson Member since:
2010-04-30

"Uh, is getting Socrates into heaven some sort of major theological issue that I've never heard of?

"

From the interview: "It solves a thorny problem that the other churches haven't touched in 2,000 years."

It is simply not true that the other churches have not touched this "problem" in 2,000 years. Here's a good article to read on the topic:

http://fatherstephen.wordpress.com/bishop-hilarion-alfeyev-on-the-d...

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[4]: The guy is an Elitist
by Nth_Man on Thu 12th Jul 2012 16:08 in reply to "RE[3]: The guy is an Elitist"
Nth_Man Member since:
2010-05-16

It is simply not true that the other churches have not touched this "problem" in 2,000 years. Here's a good article to read on the topic:

http://fatherstephen.wordpress.com/bishop-hilarion-alfeyev-on-the-d...

You're right. That 'have not touched this "problem"' that Kay said wasn't true. Also, another example is in
http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p122a5p1.ht...

They talk about it and give those references:
Cf. Council of Rome (745): DS 587
Benedict XII, Cum dudum (1341): DS 1011
Clement VI, Super quibusdam (1351): DS 1077
Council of Toledo IV (625): DS 485
Mt 27:52-53.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[3]: The guy is an Elitist
by zima on Wed 18th Jul 2012 23:46 in reply to "RE[2]: The guy is an Elitist"
zima Member since:
2005-07-06

It's not specifically about Socrates, but Socrates is often used as an example of a non-christian that should be admitted into heaven, but since he was not baptized, he can't.

I would say it is a theological problem, but not major one

A small detail, really - the number of those who'll get to Christian seems to be set at a very low level... ( http://www.nobeliefs.com/heaven.htm :p ...also http://www.luciferianliberationfront.org/borg.html )

So, we are all extremely unlikely to be among such minuscule group, almost certainly among the 100+ billion of other Homo sapiens (100+ billion already dead, who knows how much more there will be - but probably still a lot; plus, why count only Homo sapiens, why not Neanderthals? They also had death rituals, so can be safely assumed to be pretty close to us)

Reply Parent Score: 2