Linked by Thom Holwerda on Tue 28th Aug 2012 20:46 UTC
Linux "For years now, Linux has been a black sheep standing in the shadow of Apple and Microsoft. Despite having a fervent and enthusiastic following, the operating system hasn't been able to grab a sizable share of the computing market and has instead been content to subsist on the customers that come away dissatisfied with the mainstream competition. But that may be about to change. With the release of Microsoft Windows 8 on the horizon, some are saying Linux may have a great opportunity to steal a significant share of the market away from Microsoft, allowing it to finally take the helm as a major operating system service provider." This has to stop, and the only reason I'm linking to this nonsense is to make this very clear: Linux will not magically conquer the desktop or even make any significant gains because of Windows 8. People who don't like Windows 8 (Vista) will continue to use Windows 7 (Windows XP). This is getting so tiring. And does it even matter? Linux is winning big time in the mobile space, server space, and countless other spaces. The desktop is and always has been irrelevant to Linux.
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RE: Comment by Bobthearch
by orestes on Tue 28th Aug 2012 21:07 UTC in reply to "Comment by Bobthearch"
orestes
Member since:
2005-07-06

Exactly. If a distro, probably Ubuntu, got significant OEM backing it might gain some ground. Until then this talk of stealing market share from MS is just silly. If anything people who don't like 8 will just elect to remain with 7.

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[2]: Comment by Bobthearch
by Bobthearch on Tue 28th Aug 2012 21:16 in reply to "RE: Comment by Bobthearch"
Bobthearch Member since:
2006-01-27

I'm thinking of upgrading XP to Windows 7. Probably won't do it, just thinking about it. ;)

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[3]: Comment by Bobthearch
by bassbeast on Wed 29th Aug 2012 01:40 in reply to "RE[2]: Comment by Bobthearch"
bassbeast Member since:
2007-11-11

You really should, as its the first upgrade since Win2K to XP X64 where I can point to plenty of specific, concrete, useful improvements and say "That is worth upgrading for", which BTW I can't say about Win 8 because other than the boot "hack" (Look up Win 8 hybrid boot to see why its a hack) there really isn't much to like and metro is a big pile of suck on any large screen.

But comparing XP to 7 you have MUCH better memory management. With XP you can have 4Gb of RAM and still it'll hit the paging file rather than use the RAM, whereas 7 will take that RAM and load your most used programs in a cache, this means that even on my little netbook everything launches instantly thanks to RAM caching. You can actually go 64bit now without the driver hunts like I had to do with XP X64 and with RAM so cheap its a really nice boost to your speed to have that extra RAM.

Jumplists and breadcrumbs mean its incredibly simple to get back to where you were the day before, just right click on the Explorer icon to get your folders back from yesterday and right click on your browser to get your websites back, and with breadcrumbs you can instantly hop from any point you are at in the file system to root in a single click, or jump anywhere in between. I could easily list a half dozen more but those alone make it well worth the $80 upgrade price to HP IMHO, although I don't recommend pro unless you need AD support as you can get most of the same features with third party freeware and save the extra dough.

As for Linux...sigh. See my other post and read the links I provided. There are some serious issues with the fundamental way Linux is designed that is gonna have to be changed to make it ready for the masses, but like any large org trying to get everyone to change the way they do things is gonna be difficult and take years, if it ever changes. Linux was supposed to gain when Vista bombed, instead people went to XP, and in the case of 8 people will just stay with 7. In the end Linux is too much work for too little reward, especially when you can pick up a Win 7 family pack for $120, because at $30 a license all it takes is one PITA issue to make it more costly of my time than Windows costs my wallet.

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[2]: Comment by Bobthearch
by shmerl on Tue 28th Aug 2012 21:20 in reply to "RE: Comment by Bobthearch"
shmerl Member since:
2010-06-08

The real way to deal with it is to give MS serious legal beating for anticompetitive bundling. But so far they masterfully evaded such kind of outcome by escaping the equation. I.e. if refund is possible for the Windows tax - they aren't violating the law. And refund is delegated to OEMs who make it a nightmare to get. In the end MS comes out "clean" and Windows is still de facto bundled to computers all around.

So some successful cases against OEMs (like this one:
http://www.techworld.com.au/article/414500/lenovo_ordered_pay_1920_... )
can decrease their eagerness to play MS's game and will benefit Linux over all.

Edited 2012-08-28 21:38 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[3]: Comment by Bobthearch
by tomcat on Wed 29th Aug 2012 00:24 in reply to "RE[2]: Comment by Bobthearch"
tomcat Member since:
2006-01-06

The real way to deal with it is to give MS serious legal beating for anticompetitive bundling. But so far they masterfully evaded such kind of outcome by escaping the equation. I.e. if refund is possible for the Windows tax - they aren't violating the law. And refund is delegated to OEMs who make it a nightmare to get. In the end MS comes out "clean" and Windows is still de facto bundled to computers all around.

So some successful cases against OEMs (like this one:
http://www.techworld.com.au/article/414500/lenovo_ordered_pay_1920_... )
can decrease their eagerness to play MS's game and will benefit Linux over all.


Oh, please, give it a rest. OEMs have given up on selling Linux on the desktop. Nobody bought it. There is no "Windows tax" for 99.9999% of users. Only the fragment that want to install Linux.

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[2]: Comment by Bobthearch
by tylerdurden on Tue 28th Aug 2012 22:35 in reply to "RE: Comment by Bobthearch"
tylerdurden Member since:
2009-03-17

DELL sold Ubuntu machines for a while, so did HP (I think), there are some Linux-only vendors too.

Here is the thing; except for a few large institutional orders, nobody cared. There simply are not killer Linux apps for the desktop.

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[3]: Comment by Bobthearch
by Lennie on Tue 28th Aug 2012 23:41 in reply to "RE[2]: Comment by Bobthearch"
Lennie Member since:
2007-09-22

I think HP still sells Linux to businesses ( they would sell them anything they ask for probably ?)

I hear Dell still do, if you look really hard.

Also Dell is working on a Laptop for developers:

http://bartongeorge.net/tag/project-sputnik/

Based on the http://www.dell.com/us/p/xps-13-l321x/pd?~ck=mn&~ck=mn

Reply Parent Score: 2

The browser ?
by Lennie on Tue 28th Aug 2012 23:44 in reply to "RE[2]: Comment by Bobthearch"
Lennie Member since:
2007-09-22

There simply are not killer Linux apps for the desktop.


I don't think it will happen, but it could still happen that the browser could be the killer app (think things like ChromeOS). More and more apps on mobile devices are already build with HTML5. As there is no other cross-platform toolkit for these devices.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[2]: Comment by Bobthearch
by smashIt on Tue 28th Aug 2012 23:25 in reply to "RE: Comment by Bobthearch"
smashIt Member since:
2005-07-06

If a distro, probably Ubuntu, got significant OEM backing it might gain some ground.


vista didn't help linux
netbooks with linux preinstalled didn't help linux
do you realy believe metro will do the trick?
i don't....

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[3]: Comment by Bobthearch
by tomcat on Wed 29th Aug 2012 00:25 in reply to "RE[2]: Comment by Bobthearch"
tomcat Member since:
2006-01-06

"If a distro, probably Ubuntu, got significant OEM backing it might gain some ground.


vista didn't help linux
netbooks with linux preinstalled didn't help linux
do you realy believe metro will do the trick?
i don't....
"

The only thing that will help Linux is Android. And server deployment. Linux on the desktop is deader than ... well ... dead.

Reply Parent Score: 2