Linked by Thom Holwerda on Thu 18th Oct 2012 18:15 UTC
Ubuntu, Kubuntu, Xubuntu Ubuntu 12.10 has been released, sporting the rather... Interesting tagline 'Avoid the pain of Windows 8'. Two main features are that websites can now be treated as actual applications, integrating them into Unity. The divide between local and online content when searching has also been softened, which, they claim, makes it easier to find what you're looking for. On the server side, it includes the Folsom release of OpenStack, "Cinder, for block storage and Quantum, a virtual networking API. Ubuntu's Metal-as-a-Service bare-metal provisioning tool has been updated and now supports Calxeda hyperscale hardware based on ARM".
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RE[3]: ...
by Dave_K on Sat 20th Oct 2012 23:02 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: ..."
Dave_K
Member since:
2005-11-16

I get tired of Windows weenies dabbling with Linux and then concluding after half an hour that this that or the other didn't work so therefore Linux is crap.


If Linux fanboys didn't whitewash its problems then maybe people wouldn't have false expectations.

No, your hardware is probably crap or your knowledge of Linux is severely lacking. As a long-time Linux user (10 years now) I have learned that you do your homework before you purchase such things as new laptops, printers, scanners, motherboards, video cards and the like.


It's nowhere near as easy as that for two reasons:

1. Something that works in one distribution may not work in another, or even in a different version of it. I've bought hardware after finding guides to using it with Debian and still had no luck in Linux Mint. My Thinkpad, which works pretty well with Red Hat Enterprise Linux, doesn't have working power management in either Fedora or Ubuntu. Even if the hardware itself works, it's often the case that graphical configuration tools are only available for certain distributions, and then aren't updated to work with newer ones.

2. When Linux compatibility guides state that a particular piece of hardware works in Linux, they don't necessarily mean that every feature of it works perfectly. For example, I've seen soundcards listed as compatible as soon as stereo output works, which isn't much use if I want to record using the optical input. I've been called a nitpicker for complaining that my "Linux compatible" laptop's special buttons and sleep mode didn't work. The fact that Linux installed and booted to the desktop was enough for it to be considered fully compatible, with no problems worth listing.

Using Windows it really is as simple as checking that the hardware has drivers for the version I'm running. With Linux, researching compatibility often turns up a lot of misleading and incomplete information, with problems only revealed after actually trying the hardware. I'd rather save myself the time and hassle of dealing with that.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[4]: ...
by cmost on Sun 21st Oct 2012 01:46 in reply to "RE[3]: ..."
cmost Member since:
2006-07-16

"If Linux fanboys didn't whitewash its problems then maybe people wouldn't have false expectations."


Whose white-washing anything but your own ignorance?


"No, your hardware is probably crap or your knowledge of Linux is severely lacking. As a long-time Linux user (10 years now) I have learned that you do your homework before you purchase such things as new laptops, printers, scanners, motherboards, video cards and the like."


It's nowhere near as easy as that for two reasons:


"1. Something that works in one distribution may not work in another, or even in a different version of it. I've bought hardware after finding guides to using it with Debian"


See, you're confused. Debian is not Linux Mint. Red Hat Enterprise Linux isn't Debian, Fedora or Ubuntu. Again, do your homework. You don't need a graphical configuration tool to setup hardware and if you're relying on that then you don't know what you're doing and you deserve to keep paying Microsoft.


"2. When Linux compatibility guides state that a particular piece of hardware works in Linux, they don't necessarily mean that every feature of it works perfectly."

No, they don't. But why doesn't every feature work perfectly? Is it because of Linux or is it because the hardware vendor doesn't support anything other than the sacred cow Windows?


"Using Windows it really is as simple as checking that the hardware has drivers for the version I'm running. With Linux, researching compatibility often turns up a lot of misleading and incomplete information, with problems only revealed after actually trying the hardware. I'd rather save myself the time and hassle of dealing with that."


Ah yes. It's similarly easy to go out and pay for a hooker for the evening instead of doing the work required to form a real relationship. My advice to you is to just keep using Windows. It should be obvious to you why.

Edited 2012-10-21 01:49 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[5]: ...
by Dave_K on Sun 21st Oct 2012 05:35 in reply to "RE[4]: ..."
Dave_K Member since:
2005-11-16

Whose white-washing anything but your own ignorance?


Fanboys often claim that Linux is just as easy to use as Windows. In fact it was claimed in this thread that using Linux would actually save time and effort. I don't think you can blame people for believing the hype.

See, you're confused. Debian is not Linux Mint. Red Hat Enterprise Linux isn't Debian, Fedora or Ubuntu. Again, do your homework.


You're missing my point. You claimed that finding out whether hardware is compatible is a quick and easy task. In reality it's complicated by all the different distributions, as just finding out that other people are successfully using a particular device with Linux isn't enough.

You don't need a graphical configuration tool to setup hardware and if you're relying on that then you don't know what you're doing and you deserve to keep paying Microsoft.


I can do without graphical tools, but given the choice I'd rather change a setting with a couple of clicks in a control panel, instead of spending time reading howto documents and editing config files. My time is worth something.

Personally, I consider graphical configuration tools to be a pretty basic feature in a modern OS. If one isn't available for a particular piece of hardware then I wouldn't consider it to be fully supported. Obviously I've been spoilt by Windows and my expectations for Linux are simply too high.

No, they don't. But why doesn't every feature work perfectly? Is it because of Linux or is it because the hardware vendor doesn't support anything other than the sacred cow Windows?


I'm not blaming Linux, but who's to blame isn't important to me as a user. What matters to me is that I can easily find hardware that does what I want and works properly with my OS.

That's made more difficult in Linux because even a distribution's official compatibility database can provide highly misleading information, listing devices as "working perfectly" when in fact significant features are non-functional.

Reply Parent Score: 3