Linked by Kaj-de-Vos on Thu 20th Dec 2012 00:22 UTC
Syllable, AtheOS As the Syllable project predicted many years ago, version 3 of the REBOL programming language has finally been open sourced, under the Apache 2 licence (screenshot on Syllable Desktop). Also, the alpha version of the high-level Red programming language, supporting Syllable Desktop, has been released, by now in version 0.3.1 (screenshot, demo program, video at the Science Park in Amsterdam).
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Why the emphasis on Syllable?
by jockm on Sat 22nd Dec 2012 17:48 UTC
jockm
Member since:
2012-12-22

I have no skin in this game, the last time I touched REBOL was years ago and I saw what was unique and interesting about it, but didn't end up caring much about it. I suppose I could say the same thing about Syllable for that matter, but that isn't my point.

Yes, I get that there is a high concordance between REBOL folk and Syllable folk, so it is good news for that community, but it isn't their news.

Surely the point of this story is that REBOL is being open sourced, and that is where the credit should go — to Carl Sassenrath and anyone else who was involved in open sourcing the language.

Who really cares if the Syllable folk predicted that it would be open sourced? And if if you look at the time between the prediction and it happening it wasn't an especially on the nose prediction either. Nor is that the relevant bit of the story, and yet it is presented as the lead.

Let us give credit where credit is due.

Reply Score: 2

Kaj-de-Vos Member since:
2010-06-09

In no way do we claim credit for open sourcing REBOL. It doesn't say that in the article, either. The article isn't purely about the open sourcing news, it's about the fact that we integrated it in our Syllable processes. The REBOL project could have sent in their own announcement, but they didn't in the week since the release, and we wouldn't have expected them to, because they're not paying much attention to publicity.

The relevancy of the REBOL announcement to Syllable, besides the integration work, is that it is of strategic importance. We selected it for Syllable's cross-platform groupware strategy in 2005, based on its technical merits, and the fact that Syllable's app platform is Syllable-only, so it can't be used for cross-platform technology. This was a controversial thing to do, because Syllable is open source and REBOL wasn't. Besides technical merit, we did it because we expected REBOL to be open sourced eventually, and we expected to be able to work towards it using open source REBOL clones in the meantime. This is exactly what we did, although it was a somewhat chaotic path: we used the R#, ORCA and Boron REBOL-like languages successively. The open sourcing of REBOL itself marks the end of this journey, together with the fact that Red is the first REBOL-like design that is superior to REBOL itself.

Since there has been much controversy about our strategy including here on OSNews, we didn't want these two milestones to go by unnoticed.

We do claim credit for most of the contributions to Red besides the language itself:

http://www.red-lang.org/p/contributions_20.html

And others mentioned in the article. Thus they are contributed to Red by the Syllable project. We also did the port of Red to Syllable, and we developed the port of Red/System to Syllable together with others in the Red project. This way, Red will become an integral part of Syllable and therefore, most work on Red is also work on Syllable.

Reply Parent Score: 2

jockm Member since:
2012-12-22

In no way do we claim credit for open sourcing REBOL. It doesn't say that in the article, either.


Nor did I say, or imply that you did. Merely that your lead:

As the Syllable project predicted many years ago


wasn't your (meaning Syllable's) news, you buried the lead.

A better headline might have been have been:

REBOL 3 open sourced, ported to Syllable, also new Red language.


Though personally I think that is way too many stories to put in one piece. Again personally, I think that it would have been better to have one story announcing the open sourcing of REBOL 3 — aside from the article back in Sep saying that REBOL 3 would be open sourced there has been a story here about the actual release of the source — and then a separate Syllable related one.

Nor (once again) personally do I think the prediction bit was relevant to the story.

It is fine if you disagree (you wrote the story you wanted to write), I am just pointing out that I think it would have been better expressed by giving REBOL the credit for the open sourcing before you emphasize the the Syllable part.

Reply Parent Score: 1