Linked by MOS6510 on Thu 10th Jan 2013 23:25 UTC
General Development "For years I've tried my damnedest to get away from C. Too simple, too many details to manage, too old and crufty, too low level. I've had intense and torrid love affairs with Java, C++, and Erlang. I've built things I'm proud of with all of them, and yet each has broken my heart. They've made promises they couldn't keep, created cultures that focus on the wrong things, and made devastating tradeoffs that eventually make you suffer painfully. And I keep crawling back to C."
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There's no polite way to put this...
by deathshadow on Sat 12th Jan 2013 23:35 UTC
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But after some three and half decades of programming - much of it with C and C syntax languages - C (and most every language based on it) PISSES ME OFF. Needlessly cryptic, pointlessly convoluted, and seemingly intentionally designed to make 100% certain you are going to make coding mistakes, I would rather hand assemble 8k of Z80 machine language, than deal with trying to find a bug in 100 lines of C code.

The ONLY reason I put up with it is that generally speaking it's what you are forced into using by compiler availability, support, and what's expected of you in the workplace. It's easy to blame the lemmings at the rear and front -- since most of us writing software are stuck in the middle and can't see where you're going and can't stop for fear of getting trampled.

I often think C and every language based on its syntax from C++ to Java to PHP, exists for the sole purpose of making programming hard. They are certainly a far cry from the elegance of languages like Pascal or the simplicity of assembly... To be frank, I thought there were two core reasons for higher level languages -- portability - which is a joke when you're still that close to the hardware, and being simpler than machine language - which it most certainly is NOT! It gets far worse when you look at objects in most any C derivative language since they seem to be just shoehorned in any old way!

Even sadder are all these 'newer' languages that are even more needlessly cryptic and difficult to decipher like Python, Ruby, or lord help you Rust... Rust, the language for people who think C is a bit to clean and verbose -- which is akin to saying the Puritans who went to Boston in the 17th century did so because the CoE was a little too warm and fuzzy for their tastes... or founding your own extremist terrorist group because Hezbollah was a bit too warm and fuzzy. There's this noodle-doodle idiotic concept right now that typing a bunch of symbols and abbreviations most people could never remember in a hundred years is 'simpler' than using whole words -- and the quality of code has gone down the toilet thanks to it... Such idiocy explaining why people will piss away bandwidth and code clarity on halfwit rubbish frameworks like jQuery.

It's enough to make you think the old joke... isn't a joke.

Edited 2013-01-12 23:40 UTC

Reply Score: 2

kwan_e Member since:

Even sadder are all these 'newer' languages that are even more needlessly cryptic and difficult to decipher like Python, Ruby, or lord help you Rust...

I don't know about the other two, but Python is really easy to decipher. The mandatory indents make it really easy. ;)

Reply Parent Score: 2

deathshadow Member since:

I should like Python -- I really should given what a stickler I am for clear consistent formatting...

But to be brutally frank, it's more cryptic than C in it's logic structures. Take the example up above by funkyelf -- both the C and the Python versions make me want to punch someone in the face due to their lack of clarity.

But again, I worship at the throne of all things Wirth so...

I LIKE the forced formatting of Python -- I DISLIKE the unclear control structures and lack of verbose ending elements... and the needlessly short/cryptic methodology and naming conventions. By the time you get into iterators and generators, it's a needlessly convoluted mess that honestly, I have a hard time making any sense out of.

I dunno, maybe this dog is getting too old for new tricks -- but I cry for anyone trying to use python to learn with -- which is part of why I don't get why the Pi folks and many educators have such a raging chodo for it. It's the LAST thing I'd consider using to teach people to program... It's another of those languages so complex IMHO you'd be better off just sucking it up and coding machine language directly. I really don't get these high level languages that make assembly look simple.

Edited 2013-01-13 09:37 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 2