Linked by Thom Holwerda on Mon 4th Mar 2013 18:26 UTC
Ubuntu, Kubuntu, Xubuntu "Canonical has today publicly confirmed that they are working on a new cross-platform displayer server for Ubuntu. Called 'Mir', the X Window Server replacement is tasked with 'enabling development of the next generation Unity'. Which, in yet another about-turn, is to be rebuilt in Qt/QML." It'll be used for all Ubuntu variants (phone, tablet, desktop), and the first version will be released come May.
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RE[4]: Finally
by Nelson on Tue 5th Mar 2013 02:00 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Finally"
Nelson
Member since:
2005-11-29


Doesn't look like WinRT/Metro is really taking off on the desktop quite the way they hoped it would. So you reckon they'll toss that to the side and 'bet the company' on something else for Windows 9?


Well, I disagree with the notion that Windows 8 (which I assume you meant) isn't taking off. Its likely selling modestly at best, and at worst being held back by a couple of OEM conditions:

- Shortage of touch screen components and high costs
- Lack of a complete product range. The Windows lineup had holes in it. This was badly fumbled.
- Global economic conditions
- Elongated upgrade cycles for PCs.

The good news is that assuming OEMs can get their act together and put together some sub $1000 touch screen devices, then they'll have winners on their hands.

Windows 8 shines best with a touch screen and a lot of the models sold were decidedly non-touchscreen.


If not, when are we getting fully-functional winRT versions of MS Office and Visual Studio? THAT is when I'll know that they're really serious.


WinRT isn't there yet in a few places, but I agree with you they should port both apps. Especially Visual Studio.

Last time they did this, they ported large parts of VS to WPF. It greatly moved the ball forward towards them addressing architectural deficiencies in the platform while they were dogfooding WPF on such a massive scale.

But I think its important to separate WinRT, the technology, from what you perceive the reception of Windows 8 to be. Its like saying the DWM was going to be removed in Windows 7 because of people claiming Vista wasn't selling. That's not really how things work.

Prime example being WPF, it was never terribly successful, but the innovations in WPF eventually led to WinRT. These are game changing events.

WinRT has far reaching implications. Beyond Windows 8, beyond Metro, and changes the game for Windows.

It now has a first class, native, ABI safe, object oriented API. That's incredibly powerful.

They can describe APIs as Async operations with continuations and using stuff like generics and exceptions. Compare that to the mess that was classic COM.

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[5]: Finally
by WorknMan on Tue 5th Mar 2013 05:57 in reply to "RE[4]: Finally"
WorknMan Member since:
2005-11-13

WinRT has far reaching implications. Beyond Windows 8, beyond Metro, and changes the game for Windows.

It now has a first class, native, ABI safe, object oriented API. That's incredibly powerful.

They can describe APIs as Async operations with continuations and using stuff like generics and exceptions. Compare that to the mess that was classic COM.


Agree with you there, and I think it is a welcome improvement. But if they can't manage to build a desktop environment around it that doesn't suck ass, it's going to flop, just like WPF and Silverlight, albeit for different reasons.

Personally, I hope they continue to improve it and make Metro in Windows 9 something that is actually usable. Whoever it was that decided that right mouse button menus were no longer relevant, and that horizontal scrolling was a good idea on the desktop should be summarily executed. And I don't mean that figuratively either ;) In fact, we should put them into a lion's den, alongside the asshole at MS who invented the F-lock key, and then charge for admission.

Edited 2013-03-05 05:59 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 4

RE[6]: Finally
by Nelson on Tue 5th Mar 2013 06:32 in reply to "RE[5]: Finally"
Nelson Member since:
2005-11-29


Agree with you there, and I think it is a welcome improvement. But if they can't manage to build a desktop environment around it that doesn't suck ass, it's going to flop, just like WPF and Silverlight, albeit for different reasons.


I don't think they're going to build a Desktop environment as we know it. Period. I just can't see them going back at this point.

I do think that Metro Style apps will become a lot more powerful. The XAML stack will become more feature filled and support more scenarios.

They'll presumably show a lot of love to Mouse+Keyboard users. They don't really need to do much to dramatically improve the experience.

What they need more than anything is a standardized generic gesture driver for laptop touchpads. Every new Laptop with Windows 8 I saw did swiping gestures on the touchpad differently.

It ranged from completely terrible to mildly amateur. Its a nightmare. This needs addressing.


Personally, I hope they continue to improve it and make Metro in Windows 9 something that is actually usable.


Well just look at the growth from WP7.0 to WP7.5 to WP8. Its night and day. With some time behind it, Microsoft will mature the platform to be very powerful.


Whoever it was that decided that right mouse button menus were no longer relevant, and that horizontal scrolling was a good idea on the desktop should be summarily executed.


Right Mouse buttons have never been particularly discoverable, in my own analytics, people that use my apps and don't use tablets have a hard time discovering the App Bar (opened by a right click).

I've always seen the context menu used as a dumping ground for options which is annoying. There's a better way in Metro.

But Metro allows you to write Context Menus pretty easily using Popups (which is how they were made under the hood in WPF/SL. In fact, you can easily port the WP7 ContextMenu from the SL Toolkit if you want, there's a better one in Callisto a WinRT Toolkit).

I just don't think context menu's fit into Metro. A combination of app bars, content as chrome, and flyout menus can address all of the context menu scenarios.

The focus on horizontal scrolling is an artifact of their stupid obsession with 16:9 aspect ratios. I hate it. It makes portrait views on tablets useless. My Surface feels like a skateboard in portrait mode.

Reply Parent Score: 3