Linked by Thom Holwerda on Sat 4th May 2013 09:36 UTC
Hardware, Embedded Systems "NeXT Computer (the original 68030 cube) was a high end workstation that was manufactured between 1988 - 1990. Back then it was a very expensive machine as a complete system would start at $6500 (in 1988 dollars). The machine is a 1 foot cube magnesium case that houses the computer. At the time, its performance was impressive, with a Motorola 68030 CPU running at a screaming 25Mhz, a dedicated floating point CPU, and a digital signal processor built into the system. NeXT cubes featured a magneto-optical drive that stored a whopping 256 Megabytes (by comparison, high end Mac systems at the time might have featured a 20 Megabyte hard drive.) In its day, this was the "Ferrari" of desktop systems!" No new information for the average OSNews reader, but lots of beautiful photos for a beautiful Saturday afternoon.
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RE[2]: I miss NeXTstep
by GraphiteCube on Sat 4th May 2013 14:22 UTC in reply to "RE: I miss NeXTstep"
GraphiteCube
Member since:
2009-04-01

Why does every thread have to descend into "why I hate Windows 8?" I don't like it, which is why I don't use it. But that's just me. You don't like it either? Don't use it.

This is really starting to get old.

Somebodies just want flame-wars everywhere.

They don't pay for it.
They don't use it.
They aren't affected by it.

They still have their own freedom to choose what they want.

But they still yelling at it and try to restrict the others' freedom to pay for it/ use it. (Of course, they can't do it physically, so they do it verbally, spreading wrong/ outdated information.)

Don't like it? Yeah, then don't talk about it and ignore it as if it doesn't exist.

I think this kind of culture becomes popular since Apple's "PC vs Mac" advertisements. I think this just spreads hate everywhere and brings negative impact on people mind.

Yes it is off-topic but those flame-wars are polluting the discussion environment.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[3]: I miss NeXTstep
by moondevil on Sat 4th May 2013 16:58 in reply to "RE[2]: I miss NeXTstep"
moondevil Member since:
2005-07-08

I think this kind of culture becomes popular since Apple's "PC vs Mac" advertisements. I think this just spreads hate everywhere and brings negative impact on people mind.


Nah, it was just like that since the begining of home computing.

ZX Spectrum vs C64 vs Apple II vs Sam Coupé vs ....

Nintendo vs Atari vs Sega vs ...

Atari ST vs Amiga vs PC vs Mac vs ...

People seem to want to be assured they are on the right side.

Nowadays I don't care any longer as long as I can do my work.

Reply Parent Score: 9

RE[4]: I miss NeXTstep
by phoudoin on Mon 6th May 2013 07:47 in reply to "RE[3]: I miss NeXTstep"
phoudoin Member since:
2006-06-09

Nah, it was just like that since the begining of home computing.
(...)
People seem to want to be assured they are on the right side.


It just like that since the begining of... forever!
And it's not limited to home computing, far from it.
And it will not stop until humankind's end.

Get over it.
As one can ask to not use W8 instead of whining about it, one can ask to not listen to people whining about W8 instead of whining about people whining about W8...

People are free to whim.
They're also free to listen it or not.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[4]: I miss NeXTstep
by zima on Thu 9th May 2013 18:28 in reply to "RE[3]: I miss NeXTstep"
zima Member since:
2005-07-06

Nah, it was just like that since the begining of home computing.
ZX Spectrum vs C64 vs Apple II vs Sam Coupé vs ....
[...]

And the most long-lasting and holiest of holy wars: Vi vs Emacs!

Also, some of your examples are generally about the grander Commodore vs Atari holy war :p

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[3]: I miss NeXTstep
by cmost on Sat 4th May 2013 17:46 in reply to "RE[2]: I miss NeXTstep"
cmost Member since:
2006-07-16

Somebodies just want flame-wars everywhere.

They don't pay for it.
They don't use it.
They aren't affected by it.

They still have their own freedom to choose what they want....


I've been exclusively a Linux user for over ten years now and switched because of Microsoft's corporate policies and anti-competitive practices. Don't try to say with a straight face that Windows 8 doesn't affect those who don't use nor want it.

All new PC shipping with Windows 8 have UEFI and secureboot enabled by default. Different providers locate the secure boot kill-switch, if there is one, in different places and under different names in the scarily complex and dangerous UEFI control panel. Disabling secureboot cannot be done from within the operating system. Some OEM's try to obscure the killswitch so that some users can't find it. For example, on ASUS laptops it is not called 'Secure Boot' at all, but 'Legacy Mode', giving the impression that you are using something outdated and insecure. This arduous process makes it either difficult (or impossible in some cases) to install another OS. Those alternative OSs that have managed to install on these systems do so with custom bootloaders and either self-made or other special keys signed by Microsoft. How Microsoft got away with this from a legal standpoint is ridiculous.

Thankfully I can build my own systems so I can choose fully featured motherboards and avoid the hassle of secureboot myself. Unfortunately recent Linux converts, perhaps those who are trying to escape Windows 8, may not have the skills to bypass secureboot or the machine might be hindered in such a way that it can't be turned off at all. This is how Windows 8 is affecting people who otherwise wouldn't touch it with a ten foot pole and this is why those people lash out and bash Windows 8 every single chance they get!

Reply Parent Score: 6

RE[4]: I miss NeXTstep
by GraphiteCube on Sat 4th May 2013 18:39 in reply to "RE[3]: I miss NeXTstep"
GraphiteCube Member since:
2009-04-01


I've been exclusively a Linux user for over ten years now and switched because of Microsoft's corporate policies and anti-competitive practices. Don't try to say with a straight face that Windows 8 doesn't affect those who don't use nor want it.

All new PC shipping with Windows 8 have UEFI and secureboot enabled by default. Different providers locate the secure boot kill-switch, if there is one, in different places and under different names in the scarily complex and dangerous UEFI control panel. Disabling secureboot cannot be done from within the operating system. Some OEM's try to obscure the killswitch so that some users can't find it. For example, on ASUS laptops it is not called 'Secure Boot' at all, but 'Legacy Mode', giving the impression that you are using something outdated and insecure. This arduous process makes it either difficult (or impossible in some cases) to install another OS. Those alternative OSs that have managed to install on these systems do so with custom bootloaders and either self-made or other special keys signed by Microsoft. How Microsoft got away with this from a legal standpoint is ridiculous.

Thankfully I can build my own systems so I can choose fully featured motherboards and avoid the hassle of secureboot myself. Unfortunately recent Linux converts, perhaps those who are trying to escape Windows 8, may not have the skills to bypass secureboot or the machine might be hindered in such a way that it can't be turned off at all. This is how Windows 8 is affecting people who otherwise wouldn't touch it with a ten foot pole and this is why those people lash out and bash Windows 8 every single chance they get!


If someone is going to install and manage an operating systems on his own, he should have enough knowledge and spend enough time to read the hardware and software manual. If they do spend time to read the manual and they should know that there is a switch to disable Secure Boot.

If someone is just trying to install an operating systems or even a piece of software without knowing why he want to do it and how to do it in proper way, he shouldn't do it at first.

Edited 2013-05-04 18:40 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 6

RE[4]: I miss NeXTstep
by WorknMan on Sun 5th May 2013 00:16 in reply to "RE[3]: I miss NeXTstep"
WorknMan Member since:
2005-11-13

Unfortunately recent Linux converts, perhaps those who are trying to escape Windows 8, may not have the skills to bypass secureboot or the machine might be hindered in such a way that it can't be turned off at all. This is how Windows 8 is affecting people who otherwise wouldn't touch it with a ten foot pole and this is why those people lash out and bash Windows 8 every single chance they get!


Your comment makes absolutely no sense. Why would people switch to Linux to avoid Windows 8? It's not like somebody's pointing a gun to their head and forcing them to upgrade. Windows 8 is not going to magically appear on your system while you sleep. If you don't want to run Windows 8, then don't install it. By the time your current Windows apps stop working, we'll probably be at Windows 11. I would imagine anyone wanting to get out of the Windows ecosystem (who aren't Freetards or server admins) would switch to OSX anyway.

Thankfully I can build my own systems so I can choose fully featured motherboards and avoid the hassle of secureboot myself.


It's funny that the only people I hear bitching about secureboot are the ones that a) want to work around it and b) already know how to. Nobody else seems to give a damn, except for the people that it doesn't affect.

Edited 2013-05-05 00:18 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 7

RE[4]: I miss NeXTstep
by BeamishBoy on Sun 5th May 2013 12:57 in reply to "RE[3]: I miss NeXTstep"
BeamishBoy Member since:
2010-10-27

All new PC shipping with Windows 8 have UEFI and secureboot enabled by default.


I'm typing this on a new desktop that I bought ten days ago. It came with Windows 8 (64 bit) pre-installed. It doesnt' have secure boot.

Whether or not it was enabled by default is largely a non-issue for me since I run Linux within a VM anyway, but to claim that it's enabled by default on all x86-64 machines is patently false.

Reply Parent Score: 4

RE[3]: I miss NeXTstep
by UltraZelda64 on Sat 4th May 2013 20:00 in reply to "RE[2]: I miss NeXTstep"
UltraZelda64 Member since:
2006-12-05

Somebodies just want flame-wars everywhere.

They don't pay for it.
They don't use it.
They aren't affected by it.

You mean those people who need to buy a new computer and their only choice is Windows 8 are somehow not paying for it? How the hell did you come to that conclusion? I would say that at least a part of them--their bank account--was unnecessarily affected by it.

They still have their own freedom to choose what they want.

Unfortunately after the fact, in most cases.

But they still yelling at it and try to restrict the others' freedom to pay for it/ use it. (Of course, they can't do it physically, so they do it verbally, spreading wrong/ outdated information.)

It honestly sounds like you're talking about Microsoft and Secure Boot there... only they *can* and *are* attempting to lock other operating systems out physically (or virtually), not verbally.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[4]: I miss NeXTstep
by GraphiteCube on Sun 5th May 2013 06:37 in reply to "RE[3]: I miss NeXTstep"
GraphiteCube Member since:
2009-04-01

and their only choice is Windows 8


In case you don't know, Dell offers laptops with Linux pre-installed. You can also consider Chromebook.

So I think you need to re-think your arguments.

Reply Parent Score: 2