Linked by Thom Holwerda on Thu 20th Jun 2013 18:29 UTC, submitted by MOS6510
PDAs, Cellphones, Wireless So, The Wall Street Journal is reporting that Microsoft was very close to take over Nokia, but that the talks eventually broke down, probably beyond repair - at least for now. The reasons the talks broke down illustrate something that I have repeatedly tried to make clear for a long time now: Nokia isn't doing well.
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RE[2]: Go ahead and short
by bentoo on Fri 21st Jun 2013 00:22 UTC in reply to "RE: Go ahead and short"
bentoo
Member since:
2012-09-21

Nokia has been imminently dying for a while here at OSNews.


The Register had the same buyout story 12 months ago -- Since then the Nokia stock is up 50%.

In my short time on OSnews I've come to learn that:
- Nokia is always 90 days from bankruptcy.
- Every new Microsoft product and/or announcement is a sure sign of their impending doom.
- [Insert Year Here] will be the year of the Linux desktop. ;)

Reply Parent Score: 4

RE[3]: Go ahead and short
by Nelson on Fri 21st Jun 2013 01:47 in reply to "RE[2]: Go ahead and short"
Nelson Member since:
2005-11-29

The whole thing is stupid. I've long been arguing for a more measured analysis of Nokia, in which hey, maybe they aren't going to die, and hey, maybe Windows Phone does sell more than two phones.

In order to understand the seemingly irrational hate, it is important to understand where it comes from. MeeGo was the white horse of every fanboy with a hard on for Linux. No matter the fact that it was severely behind schedule and under cooked. No matter the fact that MeeGo on the N9 wasn't even real MeeGo. No matter the fact that Nokia was actively DYING during this time.

They hate that Nokia killed MeeGo. They hate it even more than Nokia killed MeeGo for Windows Phone. Nokia went from darling to devil overnight on OSNews.

Its been crazy land since then.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[4]: Go ahead and short
by allanregistos on Fri 21st Jun 2013 04:17 in reply to "RE[3]: Go ahead and short"
allanregistos Member since:
2011-02-10

The whole thing is stupid. I've long been arguing for a more measured analysis of Nokia, in which hey, maybe they aren't going to die, and hey, maybe Windows Phone does sell more than two phones.


The last time I've been in our local mall. Nokia's bou·tique is a ghost town. 12 years go, Nokia is the only kid in town. Now, people have move on with My|Phone, Samsung, Cherry Mobile and many other Android devices in addition to iPhone. Had Nokia release an Android device, it would sell, since many people are interested in phones in the name of Android.

Edited 2013-06-21 04:30 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[4]: Go ahead and short
by j-kidd on Fri 21st Jun 2013 04:38 in reply to "RE[3]: Go ahead and short"
j-kidd Member since:
2005-07-06

I read a similar article [1] yesterday, and immediately opened up OSNews, thinking to myself that "this would be the perfect article for Thom to troll Nelson".

Anyway, I think you got some of the "facts" wrong. From the perspective of a true Linux fanboy, the real tragedy happened when the MeeGo merger was announced by the previous CEO. I have no insider knowledge, but my thinking is that if you want to get a team to pivot from DEB to RPM, you might as well just kill the project.

Few weeks after the announcement of Meego, N900 was made available in my country and I immediately placed a pre-order. Never had any faith in MeeGo.

[1] http://www.unwiredview.com/2013/06/20/nokia-in-acquisition-talks-wi...

Edited 2013-06-21 04:44 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 5

RE[4]: Go ahead and short
by hhas on Fri 21st Jun 2013 23:09 in reply to "RE[3]: Go ahead and short"
hhas Member since:
2006-11-28

MeeGo was the white horse of every fanboy with a hard on for Linux. No matter the fact that it was severely behind schedule and under cooked. [...] They hate that Nokia killed MeeGo. They hate it even more than Nokia killed MeeGo for Windows Phone. Nokia went from darling to devil overnight on OSNews.


True dat. I think on balance, throwing in Nokia's lot with WP probably was the better bet at the time. For all the praise the N9 device got, it had absolutely no ecosystem around it: Nokia would've had to build that up from scratch all by itself; a huge challenge. WP offered Nokia the promise of a readymade ecosystem, giving them a big boost in playing catchup with Android and iOS. In Elop's shoes, I'd have made the same call. Strong ecosystem will get you through times of weak products better than great products will get you through times of lousy ecosystem.

Elop's one single screwup (and it was a spectacular one) was burning Symbian before their WP handsets were anywhere close to shipping. That created a classic Osborne Effect where the existing Symbian customer base jumped ship to competing iOS and Android platforms - which were already available - instead of migrating smoothly to Nokia's new WP platform, which wasn't.

In addition to seriously damaging Nokia as a business, that little stunt also hurt WP's credibility as a trustworthy alternative to iOS/Android, which not only damages MS's credibility but also means there's less of a WP ecosystem to help buoy up Nokia; and so it goes around and around. None of which'll discourage the peanut gallery's favorite narratives that WP sucks because its app store is smaller than iOS and Android's, or that Elop was an inside agent setting up Nokia for MS takeover. Say what you like, at least they're consistent in their inconsistency.


It's also worth remembering that MS themselves are only partway through their own product transition, and while it's far from smooth they are not standing still. If MS can provide strong business integration in the next WP release, that might give Nokia a boost by eating Blackberry's share and maybe clawing back some of the iOS/Android business users. iOS in particular should be a soft target for a business-friendly WP, since Apple's a consumer product company and while they do great shiny they can't sell business infrastructure for shit.

Personally, I'd wait for Nokia's Q2-Q4 results before calling it one way or the other. The graph shows their freefall phase is ended (i.e. they've no more Symbian users to lose), so now the question is whether they're currently at the bottom of a large U-curve - in which case it'll head back into overall growth - or sliding into a long tail along with Blackberry and the other has-beens and also-rans.

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[4]: Go ahead and short
by zima on Thu 27th Jun 2013 20:26 in reply to "RE[3]: Go ahead and short"
zima Member since:
2005-07-06

MeeGo was the white horse of every fanboy with a hard on for Linux. No matter the fact that it was severely behind schedule and under cooked. No matter the fact that MeeGo on the N9 wasn't even real MeeGo. No matter the fact that Nokia was actively DYING during this time.
They hate that Nokia killed MeeGo.

...and they readily overlook how the killed Meego kitten wasn't that good; sort of in the tradition of Nokia OS (as highlighted in the conclusion of http://www.mobile-review.com/review/nokia-n9-2-en.shtml for example)

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[3]: Go ahead and short
by Adam S on Fri 21st Jun 2013 13:34 in reply to "RE[2]: Go ahead and short"
Adam S Member since:
2005-04-01

In my short time on OSnews I've come to learn that:
- Nokia is always 90 days from bankruptcy.


With their stock, how is this an extreme prediction?

- Every new Microsoft product and/or announcement is a sure sign of their impending doom.


I challenge you to find where anyone on staff said anything like that. It's an unquestionable fact that Windows 8 has not been a success. Writing about that doesn't mean the sky is falling.

- [Insert Year Here] will be the year of the Linux desktop. ;)


That's just bs. Not one of the staff at OSNews uses Linux on their desktop as a primary OS. I wonder if you can find where anyone said something like that that wasn't in jest. We're all fans and proponents of desktop Linux, but I don't think anyone thinks it's about the break and become the next #1 OS on a PC.

Reply Parent Score: 6

RE[4]: Go ahead and short
by fretinator on Fri 21st Jun 2013 18:30 in reply to "RE[3]: Go ahead and short"
fretinator Member since:
2005-07-06

In the New Era of Truthiness, facts are collateral damage.

Reply Parent Score: 5

RE[4]: Go ahead and short
by bentoo on Fri 21st Jun 2013 23:27 in reply to "RE[3]: Go ahead and short"
bentoo Member since:
2012-09-21

"In my short time on OSnews I've come to learn that:
- Nokia is always 90 days from bankruptcy.


With their stock, how is this an extreme prediction?
"

Same thing was said about Apple in the 90s now look at their market valuation.

"- Every new Microsoft product and/or announcement is a sure sign of their impending doom.


I challenge you to find where anyone on staff said anything like that. It's an unquestionable fact that Windows 8 has not been a success. Writing about that doesn't mean the sky is falling.
"

I never said the staff wrote anything of the like. That said, 100M licenses in 6 months doesn't actually qualify as a failure either.

"- [Insert Year Here] will be the year of the Linux desktop. ;)


That's just bs. Not one of the staff at OSNews uses Linux on their desktop as a primary OS. I wonder if you can find where anyone said something like that that wasn't in jest. We're all fans and proponents of desktop Linux, but I don't think anyone thinks it's about the break and become the next #1 OS on a PC.
"

Obviously missing the joke. ;)

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[4]: Go ahead and short
by zima on Thu 27th Jun 2013 20:16 in reply to "RE[3]: Go ahead and short"
zima Member since:
2005-07-06

Adam S, OSNews is largely about the comments though ...and you can certainly see the sentiments highlighted by bentoo prevailing in them.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[3]: Go ahead and short
by cdude on Sat 22nd Jun 2013 13:34 in reply to "RE[2]: Go ahead and short"
cdude Member since:
2008-09-21

The Register had the same buyout story 12 months ago

And as we just learned Microsoft and Nokia are in talks about a buy out since a year or so now.

Huawei's interest just became public NOW. Who knows how long they try to negotiate behind private walls to ... buy out Nokia. A year?

Also there is the Lenovo Nokia buy out case which became public a few months ago. Be sure that before it became public private talks where going on.

So, who do you tell nothing like that is going on for a long long time now? Its just that Nokia is a high risk. Just like Microsoft wrote in his reasoning why negotiation failed. Nokia is falling so fast that when you buy out today its worth 1/10 of what you payed tomorrow.

Edited 2013-06-22 13:39 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 1