Linked by Thom Holwerda on Thu 20th Jun 2013 18:29 UTC, submitted by MOS6510
PDAs, Cellphones, Wireless So, The Wall Street Journal is reporting that Microsoft was very close to take over Nokia, but that the talks eventually broke down, probably beyond repair - at least for now. The reasons the talks broke down illustrate something that I have repeatedly tried to make clear for a long time now: Nokia isn't doing well.
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RE[3]: Go ahead and short
by Nelson on Fri 21st Jun 2013 01:47 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Go ahead and short"
Nelson
Member since:
2005-11-29

The whole thing is stupid. I've long been arguing for a more measured analysis of Nokia, in which hey, maybe they aren't going to die, and hey, maybe Windows Phone does sell more than two phones.

In order to understand the seemingly irrational hate, it is important to understand where it comes from. MeeGo was the white horse of every fanboy with a hard on for Linux. No matter the fact that it was severely behind schedule and under cooked. No matter the fact that MeeGo on the N9 wasn't even real MeeGo. No matter the fact that Nokia was actively DYING during this time.

They hate that Nokia killed MeeGo. They hate it even more than Nokia killed MeeGo for Windows Phone. Nokia went from darling to devil overnight on OSNews.

Its been crazy land since then.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[4]: Go ahead and short
by allanregistos on Fri 21st Jun 2013 04:17 in reply to "RE[3]: Go ahead and short"
allanregistos Member since:
2011-02-10

The whole thing is stupid. I've long been arguing for a more measured analysis of Nokia, in which hey, maybe they aren't going to die, and hey, maybe Windows Phone does sell more than two phones.


The last time I've been in our local mall. Nokia's bou·tique is a ghost town. 12 years go, Nokia is the only kid in town. Now, people have move on with My|Phone, Samsung, Cherry Mobile and many other Android devices in addition to iPhone. Had Nokia release an Android device, it would sell, since many people are interested in phones in the name of Android.

Edited 2013-06-21 04:30 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[5]: Go ahead and short
by cdude on Fri 21st Jun 2013 14:20 in reply to "RE[4]: Go ahead and short"
cdude Member since:
2008-09-21

I am surprised your town still has a Nokia shop. Here they got all closed within last year.

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[4]: Go ahead and short
by j-kidd on Fri 21st Jun 2013 04:38 in reply to "RE[3]: Go ahead and short"
j-kidd Member since:
2005-07-06

I read a similar article [1] yesterday, and immediately opened up OSNews, thinking to myself that "this would be the perfect article for Thom to troll Nelson".

Anyway, I think you got some of the "facts" wrong. From the perspective of a true Linux fanboy, the real tragedy happened when the MeeGo merger was announced by the previous CEO. I have no insider knowledge, but my thinking is that if you want to get a team to pivot from DEB to RPM, you might as well just kill the project.

Few weeks after the announcement of Meego, N900 was made available in my country and I immediately placed a pre-order. Never had any faith in MeeGo.

[1] http://www.unwiredview.com/2013/06/20/nokia-in-acquisition-talks-wi...

Edited 2013-06-21 04:44 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 5

RE[5]: Go ahead and short
by przemo_li on Fri 21st Jun 2013 08:00 in reply to "RE[4]: Go ahead and short"
przemo_li Member since:
2010-06-01

Man.

MeeGo N9 GOT AWARDS FOR DESIGN OVER ***IPHONE***

Yes, professionals gave it better ratings than they gave to Apple product.

German press advised their german readers to go shopping to SWITZERLAND because Nokia refused to sell N9 in Germany.

That is success. And of course you WONT find any info about how N9 sold in Nokia info releases. But you will easily find Nokia CEO statements about NOT CONTINUING WITH N9 AND MEEGO **EVEN IF** ITS SUCCESSFUL.

Oh and MeeGo would run some of Symbian Apps, it would be big differentiation for Nokia, and Symbian partners would be able to jump in...

WinP was clean break.


Its impossible that WinP could outperform MeeGo in short term. Its just not possible. (And Nokia did not shared any info which by itself is indicative..)

Reply Parent Score: 6

RE[4]: Go ahead and short
by hhas on Fri 21st Jun 2013 23:09 in reply to "RE[3]: Go ahead and short"
hhas Member since:
2006-11-28

MeeGo was the white horse of every fanboy with a hard on for Linux. No matter the fact that it was severely behind schedule and under cooked. [...] They hate that Nokia killed MeeGo. They hate it even more than Nokia killed MeeGo for Windows Phone. Nokia went from darling to devil overnight on OSNews.


True dat. I think on balance, throwing in Nokia's lot with WP probably was the better bet at the time. For all the praise the N9 device got, it had absolutely no ecosystem around it: Nokia would've had to build that up from scratch all by itself; a huge challenge. WP offered Nokia the promise of a readymade ecosystem, giving them a big boost in playing catchup with Android and iOS. In Elop's shoes, I'd have made the same call. Strong ecosystem will get you through times of weak products better than great products will get you through times of lousy ecosystem.

Elop's one single screwup (and it was a spectacular one) was burning Symbian before their WP handsets were anywhere close to shipping. That created a classic Osborne Effect where the existing Symbian customer base jumped ship to competing iOS and Android platforms - which were already available - instead of migrating smoothly to Nokia's new WP platform, which wasn't.

In addition to seriously damaging Nokia as a business, that little stunt also hurt WP's credibility as a trustworthy alternative to iOS/Android, which not only damages MS's credibility but also means there's less of a WP ecosystem to help buoy up Nokia; and so it goes around and around. None of which'll discourage the peanut gallery's favorite narratives that WP sucks because its app store is smaller than iOS and Android's, or that Elop was an inside agent setting up Nokia for MS takeover. Say what you like, at least they're consistent in their inconsistency.


It's also worth remembering that MS themselves are only partway through their own product transition, and while it's far from smooth they are not standing still. If MS can provide strong business integration in the next WP release, that might give Nokia a boost by eating Blackberry's share and maybe clawing back some of the iOS/Android business users. iOS in particular should be a soft target for a business-friendly WP, since Apple's a consumer product company and while they do great shiny they can't sell business infrastructure for shit.

Personally, I'd wait for Nokia's Q2-Q4 results before calling it one way or the other. The graph shows their freefall phase is ended (i.e. they've no more Symbian users to lose), so now the question is whether they're currently at the bottom of a large U-curve - in which case it'll head back into overall growth - or sliding into a long tail along with Blackberry and the other has-beens and also-rans.

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[5]: Go ahead and short
by jeffb on Sat 22nd Jun 2013 13:44 in reply to "RE[4]: Go ahead and short"
jeffb Member since:
2005-07-19

Elop's one single screwup (and it was a spectacular one) was burning Symbian before their WP handsets were anywhere close to shipping. That created a classic Osborne Effect where the existing Symbian customer base jumped ship to competing iOS and Android platforms - which were already available - instead of migrating smoothly to Nokia's new WP platform, which wasn't.


I don't think that was even much of a screw up. Symbian phones weren't making much margin and sales had been falling for 3 quarters. Elop by shocking his people get them to move off MeeGo fast. He bought himself a transition that say compared to RIM's BBOS to QNX transition took 11 months less. Nokia is not the CIA. He couldn't have killed off MeeGo as quickly as he did in secret.

Those 11 months were key to how Nokia passed RIM in sales and is having far greater manufacturing capacity than RIM has for this generation of phones. Given Nokia's high restructuring and write down costs I don't know that he did the wrong thing.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[4]: Go ahead and short
by zima on Thu 27th Jun 2013 20:26 in reply to "RE[3]: Go ahead and short"
zima Member since:
2005-07-06

MeeGo was the white horse of every fanboy with a hard on for Linux. No matter the fact that it was severely behind schedule and under cooked. No matter the fact that MeeGo on the N9 wasn't even real MeeGo. No matter the fact that Nokia was actively DYING during this time.
They hate that Nokia killed MeeGo.

...and they readily overlook how the killed Meego kitten wasn't that good; sort of in the tradition of Nokia OS (as highlighted in the conclusion of http://www.mobile-review.com/review/nokia-n9-2-en.shtml for example)

Reply Parent Score: 2