Linked by Thom Holwerda on Mon 1st Jul 2013 23:07 UTC
Mozilla & Gecko clones "Mozilla today announced that the regional launches of Firefox OS smartphones will begin soon. Deutsche Telekom and Telefonica will release the first Firefox OS devices, the ALCATEL ONE TOUCH Fire and the ZTE Open, soon. Individual partners will announce specifics about launches in each market soon." Lots of soons in there.
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RE[8]: I think it's exciting
by Nelson on Thu 4th Jul 2013 14:58 UTC in reply to "RE[7]: I think it's exciting"
Nelson
Member since:
2005-11-29

JavaScript isn't a pain to work with, what most devs do is try to program JavaScript like Java/C# because it kinda looks a bit like it.


Oh come on, the lack of basic compile time semantic analysis is a huge draw back. Hard to debug typos can trip someone up in JavaScript. Did you mean to reference a property or create an entirely new one? Its ambiguous.

When dealing with complex application scale projects (Like Mozilla wants to enable) you quickly run up against a productivity wall.


Once you appreciate the language and program it the right way, it isn't problematic.


I held this view for a while. I figured I was too ignorant of the benefits so it only made the drawbacks seem more pronounced. After using it in practice, watching PluralSight courses on the subject matter, and acquainting myself with the paradigm I can't say I'm convinced.

Its novel, its different, maybe even cool, but its far from perfect and in my opinion does not justify the drawbacks.

Now, that doesn't preclude me from appreciating the fact that some people do like it which is why I'm in favor of a language agnostic web in which there is a standard byte code.


I don't think you get it, nobody wants to write in Dart. Dart is Google's second attempt at making GWT, nobody wanted it the first time around.


GWT was an abomination, but Dart is taking on that same problem space with a slightly different approach. While I do prefer the optional static typing in Dart, I am much more interested in a standard web bytecode format.


Once you know what you are doing in JavaScript it actually kinda nice to code in. Why do you think Node.js has got so popular?


Node.js got popular because it scales extremely well for a particular set of circumstances, and because it lowered barriers to entry to large scale service programming.

What's easier, understanding a .NET or Java SDK or using familiar skills? That was the draw of using JS as the basis for Node, but Node is much more than JS.

The entire eventing platform its built on top is what enables the magic, JS is just a language. Could've easily been anything else.

Reply Parent Score: 3

lucas_maximus Member since:
2009-08-18

Oh come on, the lack of basic compile time semantic analysis is a huge draw back. Hard to debug typos can trip someone up in JavaScript. Did you mean to reference a property or create an entirely new one? Its ambiguous.

When dealing with complex application scale projects (Like Mozilla wants to enable) you quickly run up against a productivity wall.


Sorry the JS community doesn't really care about these pretend porblems that you are making up.

Look we have pretty much well defined patterns now which allow us to make a robust testable framework.

Compile Time Checks and Analysis while good don't tell the whole story about a code base, and I have worked on some truly nightmarish C# and Java beasts.

Also if you really need this stuff most modern JS IDEs have similar tools built in and are affordable. Also there are options for LINT tools and the like.

I kinda agree with you but at the same time I have to say if you write it the right way it eliminates a huge number of problems.

But that is just my experience.

I held this view for a while. I figured I was too ignorant of the benefits so it only made the drawbacks seem more pronounced. After using it in practice, watching PluralSight courses on the subject matter, and acquainting myself with the paradigm I can't say I'm convinced.

Its novel, its different, maybe even cool, but its far from perfect and in my opinion does not justify the drawbacks.

Now, that doesn't preclude me from appreciating the fact that some people do like it which is why I'm in favor of a language agnostic web in which there is a standard byte code.


Similar arguments are made against VB.NET, while you can create some hideous code in it and tbh the language is somewhat ugly anyway ... if you write it properly it just as good as anything written in C# for the most part.

I think we will have to agree to disagree.

GWT was an abomination, but Dart is taking on that same problem space with a slightly different approach. While I do prefer the optional static typing in Dart, I am much more interested in a standard web bytecode format.


Node.js got popular because it scales extremely well for a particular set of circumstances, and because it lowered barriers to entry to large scale service programming.

What's easier, understanding a .NET or Java SDK or using familiar skills? That was the draw of using JS as the basis for Node, but Node is much more than JS.

The entire eventing platform its built on top is what enables the magic, JS is just a language. Could've easily been anything else.


Coming from a Java/C# background I found it harder to think like you do when coding in JavaScript. But maybe that is because of the environments I have worked in .. who knows.

I like the freedom of writing in JavaScript which quite frankly Java and C# don't give me. I think there are quite a few that prefer coding with the shackles off to a certain extent.

Reply Parent Score: 3